Photo #42102: Lepidoptera sp.

10.08.2015 15:59, Leon Ortlieb

Goodness! Simple and Research in quotes .. Okay.
I can perefotat German determinant table, no question. Something to translate if necessary. But of course, these tables can not be exhibited here, and it is necessary to make your own. And with improvements.
If you need to give the address of Internet - shop where the determinant of the day butterflies there.

10.08.2015 13:52, Peter Khramov

Leon, well, there Well, even quotes are what really Bole: -)

10.08.2015 13:49, Leon Ortlieb

Peter, "2. pop" unscientific. "" Let's replace the word for amateur determinant for fans.
I forgot to say that under these tables reference is made to page 60, where there is also a lively Belyanko photo, close up. (On page 59 is a description of the form. 2 form (their description) on one page.) And normally, the tables are guided, then you check the description of the indicated page ..
.

08.08.2015 0:31, Shamil Murtazin

Only I suggested not to reinvent the wheel, and at least collect his major pieces. Determinant benefit a lot. Yes, the same determinant Migranova. He is the same essence that insektamo, but no illustrations.
(I think that sooner or later everything will come to that, what I'm saying, but only by his unknown)

07.08.2015 22:56, Peter Khramov

I understand that Shamil proposed to ask the author, and do not think ... However, the direct copying of here and the truth is not gud. At the time, I talked to the author about the integration of its site Lepidoptera, but as always, the friendship did not win. And this was perhaps the most appropriate version of the task.Maybe, in the framework of the insects return to this question, though not very likely any changes, more a matter of personal sites - more emotional than rational.

07.08.2015 22:10, Vasiliy Feoktistov

And it is necessary, I copy with insektamo? I think no.
Not only will it look bad. Moreover, the sole author and owner of the domain insectamo.ru (ex. Sungaya.narod.ru) have among the sponsors of the site. I know this is exactly how it will contact and has long been helping this man and his site c definition of beetles and the add photos from my collection)))
The site lepidoptera.ru should have its own, original oprdelitel and copy-paste the network to produce nothing :)

07.08.2015 19:46, Shamil Murtazin

There have already determinants. Making the similarity insektamo. Mikrocheshuyu, the Far East, border types, etc. add later.
Local search is already available, it is necessary to ask for permission and copy insektamo, and let the user chooses that it is more convenient. Plus, these methods can be cross :)

07.08.2015 18:27, Peter Khramov

I think there are two approaches to creating determinants.

1. Classic, "scientific". Take a list of mes / antithesis (for dichotomous key) or characteristic values ​​(for polytomous) and, in fact, do. This, by itself, will help illustrate. But the main work here is still rather than in graphics, namely tezah / symptoms.The priority of this approach - accuracy.
And yes, without specific terminilogii do not succeed at all and nothing.

2. pop "unscientific." Take a clear list of all (or many) signs and do it on the basis of polytomous "determinant".In this illustration play a very prominent role and the work of "the definition of" being like this:
Entering a value of clear and well-known user characteristics (eg geography, color, a first approximation of the classification), are displayed on the picture / description of suitable species are compared visually and by text.In general, something like the present Catalogue, only the more filled.
The priority of this approach - ease of use.
No terminology do more or less possible.

The second option is necessary in any case, because it combines the functions of the catalog and the determinant. Without the catalog is still nowhere.The first is also good, but here it requires the participation of specialists.

07.08.2015 17:21, Leon Ortlieb

Dmitri, in this case, yes. But it is also self and between species.
If you do a real determinant, to date, the only way, and applying for comparing similar close - (Kie) species.
This will be the determinant of demand and a bookshelf.
And it will be clear to all amateurs, without what it takes to teach anatomy and spets.zhargon butterflies ..Those couple of hundred butterflies Palearctic, it should be possible .. Or?
I was the first stone for the construction brought ..

Peter often these descriptions zamorocheny so that spice spices do not understand. Arrow yeah .. It would help to understand the more ..

07.08.2015 15:21, Peter Khramov

When there are illustrations (even without arrows), and the normal description of the differences in the text, dolepit comparison is not much difficult.

07.08.2015 15:08, Dmitriy Pozhogin

And who is willing to do it? A photo on the differences males from females shown)))

07.08.2015 10:12, Leon Ortlieb

Peter raised the issue of the determinant site. I support, I think that's somewhere around so it should look .. The differences illustrate the differences in the photo and arrows and circles to identify those specified area. How could a Belyanko. Type "inner corner of the upper wing Belyanko step" etc ..And especially important with similar views ..

This is coupled with the description of the type, greatly simplify the definition.