Autumn fishing

Indian summer is still ahead. It's too early to despair. Here is a small part of what flies in September-October from macro-raznousyh.

Acherontia atropos
Hyles gallii
Staurophora celsia
Lemonia dumi
Lemonia taraxaci
Catocala fraxini
Catocala nupta
Phragmatobia fuliginosa
Colotois pennaria
Diloba caeruleocephala
Acherontia atropos
Epirrita autumnata
Schrankia costaestrigalis
Chortodes pygminus
Gortyna flavago
Thera juniperata
Agrochola helvola
Ammoconia caecimacula
Rhizedra lutosa
Helicoverpa armigera
Abraxas sylvatus
Agrochola circellaris
Acronicta auricoma
Hypena rostralis
Ptilophora plumigera
Amphipoea oculea
Xanthia togata
Xanthia icteritia
Xanthia ocellaris
Perizoma parallelolineatum
Orthonama vittatum
Larentia clavaria
Scoliopteryx libatrix
Caradrina clavipalpis
Ennomos fuscantarius
Ennomos autumnarius
Ennomos erosarius
Erannis defoliaria
Larerannis orthogrammaria
Poecilocampa populi
Anarta trifolii
Macdunnoughia confusa
Eublemma purpurina
Timandra comae
Diachrysia chrysitis
Autographa gamma
Amphipyra pyramidea
Amphipyra berbera
Nonagria typhae
Eupsilia transversa
Xylena vetusta
Mythimna pallens
Noctua interposita
Xestia c-nigrum
Agrotis ipsilon
Agrotis segetum
Operophtera fagata
Operophtera brumata

Complete the list!

Indian summer is still ahead. It's too early to despair. Here is a small part of what flies in September-October from macro-raznousyh.

Acherontia atropos
Hyles gallii
Staurophora celsia
Lemonia dumi
Lemonia taraxaci
Catocala fraxini
Catocala nupta
Phragmatobia fuliginosa
Colotois pennaria
Diloba caeruleocephala
Acherontia atropos
Epirrita autumnata
Schrankia costaestrigalis
Chortodes pygminus
Gortyna flavago
Thera juniperata
Agrochola helvola
Ammoconia caecimacula
Rhizedra lutosa
Helicoverpa armigera
Abraxas sylvatus
Agrochola circellaris
Acronicta auricoma
Hypena rostralis
Ptilophora plumigera
Amphipoea oculea
Xanthia togata
Xanthia icteritia
Xanthia ocellaris
Perizoma parallelolineatum
Orthonama vittatum
Larentia clavaria
Scoliopteryx libatrix
Caradrina clavipalpis
Ennomos fuscantarius
Ennomos autumnarius
Ennomos erosarius
Erannis defoliaria
Larerannis orthogrammaria
Poecilocampa populi
Anarta trifolii
Macdunnoughia confusa
Eublemma purpurina
Timandra comae
Diachrysia chrysitis
Autographa gamma
Amphipyra pyramidea
Amphipyra berbera
Nonagria typhae
Eupsilia transversa
Xylena vetusta
Mythimna pallens
Noctua interposita
Xestia c-nigrum
Agrotis ipsilon
Agrotis segetum
Operophtera fagata
Operophtera brumata

Complete the list!

Instead of two unlikely ones from the list of Acherontia atropos, we expect Agrius convolvuli.

Instead of two unlikely ones from the list of Acherontia atropos, we expect Agrius convolvuli.

Hyles euphorbiae, in turn, is more expected than Agrius convolvuli:)

Hyles euphorbiae, in turn, is more expected than Agrius convolvuli:)

I wouldn't say that . For the convolvulus imago in September in the middle zone is a common occurrence, although it is not numerous here as in the south. Euphorbia also fits in the summer months, managing to give 2 generations, the third autumn generation in such northern regions from the category of casuistry. In general, in abnormal years, many summer varieties can give an additional autumn generation (often partial), but this is not what we are talking about. From hawkmoth, then you need to safely add linden here, they also talk about poplar trees in September (I caught them myself in the third decade of August), etc..

I wouldn't say that . For the convolvulus imago in September in the middle zone is a common occurrence, although it is not numerous here as in the south. Euphorbia also fits in the summer months, managing to give 2 generations, the third autumn generation in such northern regions from the category of casuistry. In general, in abnormal years, many summer varieties can give an additional autumn generation (often partial), but this is not what we are talking about. From hawkmoth, then you need to safely add linden here, they also talk about poplar trees in September (I caught them myself in the third decade of August), etc..

Well, we're talking about this year. I do not yet know how the harvest of bindweed hawkmoth in the Crimea is going, whether they will reach us at all. But the fact that it is now milkweed and bedstraw hawkmoth flies to the heap, it is a fact, the early summer in the middle latitudes in this regard was favorable for them, I do not know whether the second or third generation is now with them this year.

This year I caught two generations of the Podmarenkovo hawk moth generation.Molochainovo didn't catch a single one.Poplar trees appeared in the middle of summer, flew for two weeks and that's all.There were a lot of lime trees from May to July, then they disappeared.Pine trees were there all the time, as well as eye-shaped ones.There were few medium-sized wine shops.That's all for them.At the end of May, there were a lot of harpies.In July, oak cocoonworms appeared.There are fewer Makhoans than in the past.Only one request was submitted.There are a lot of poplar tapeworms.I first met a mourner.In August, for two weekends, nothing at all.Well, like nothing)))) about twenty hornets flew in)))Perhaps the fact is that it was very dry then, even the nettles were dry in the field.
I put a lamp in the city, fly blue, red (in July crimson) ribbons.
On Friday I will go again, I think the situation has changed.

Molochainovo didn't catch a single one.

What I can recommend... change biotopes more often when fishing.

I wouldn't say that . For the convolvulus imago in September in the middle zone is a common occurrence, although it is not numerous here as in the south. Euphorbia also fits in the summer months, managing to give 2 generations, the third autumn generation in such northern regions from the category of casuistry. In general, in abnormal years, many summer varieties can give an additional autumn generation (often partial), but this is not what we are talking about. From hawkmoth, then you need to safely add linden here, they also talk about poplar trees in September (I caught them myself in the third decade of August), etc..

Extremely unfortunate statement. Euphorbia hawkmoth in the Ryazan region I come across (and in quantity) all the last 5 years that I go to this region in the fall. Not only in September, but also until mid-October.
And this is a fact that has nothing to do with casuistry. By the way, 3 years ago in the Moscow region on October 10, glazchatyi arrived, this is really an accident...
Yes, you are unlikely to see taraxasi already. I didn't see him in the middle lane after August 20. Although this is only my personal experience, maybe someone will correct it.

This post was edited by sdi - 28.08.2012 22: 07

Well,for example, bindweed on terr. Kaluga region, not typical, somewhere to the zone of settling down can be caught,and in the zone of forests is very rare, mostly on the lower level. Volga, in the district of Tsagan-Oman, 1 specimen was caught in the light in August of the 25th, with which the years ended at 23-30, at T-15C.

I still don't know how the harvest of bindweed hawkmoth is going in Crimea

In the Crimea, this season they are almost nonexistent. For the whole summer I saw 1 or 2 copies.

Summer is still going on!In the country, a bunch of swallowtail caterpillars eat dill and carrots.This year there are also many mourning days.I even met two people at the Ploshchad Ilyich metro station...
It's still too early to talk about autumn fishing.

Extremely unfortunate statement. Euphorbia hawkmoth in the Ryazan region I come across (and in quantity) all the last 5 years that I go to this region in the fall. Not only in September, but also until mid-October.
And this is a fact that has nothing to do with casuistry. By the way, 3 years ago in the Moscow region on October 10, glazchatyi arrived, this is really an accident...
Yes, you are unlikely to see taraxasi already. I didn't see him in the middle lane after August 20. Although this is only my personal experience, maybe someone will correct it.

"Extremely unfortunate statement" is based on many years of observations and training sessions in the Nizhny Novgorod region. If it was noticed, then niyaz and I were just figuring out what could be collected in the Ryazan region in the fall and with what probability, while neither I nor, as I understand it, were there , i.e. the discussion was "in theory" for the entire middle zone of European Russia, which was an idea initially ungrateful, given the scale of the territory and the variety of climatic and biotopic conditions. I don't know how in the settled south of our region, but in the center and in the west, where I collected, milkweed hawkmoth is not only not found in the fall, it is also extremely rare in the summer. What can not be said about the loach-on the left bank of the Oka River, on the settled meadows with Convolvulus arvensis, it is a frequent visitor to the DRL at the end of August-September (of course, it is not necessary every year), especially near phlox, petunias, sweet tobacco, etc. blooming in the gardens, on which the imago feeds.

I knew from the spurge hawk moth that in the forest zone of European Russia it is a temporarily rooting species, flying throughout the summer and until the beginning of autumn in 1-2 generations, but as a rule, it does not tolerate wintering, and in different periods it occurs with very different frequency.
You can find interesting information about it here. In the literature available to me, I have not seen anything like this, in extreme cases it is indicated that in favorable years it can fly until the end of August-mid(!) September. And so that until mid-October… (it is a pity that you have autumn observations in Ryazan only for the last 5 years). This is casuistry, i.e. when cases were previously unknown or were noted only sporadically. So it will continue if you do not publish your observations.

Well, we're talking about this year. I do not yet know how the harvest of bindweed hawkmoth in the Crimea is going, whether they will reach us at all. But the fact that it is now milkweed and bedstraw hawkmoth flies to the heap, it is a fact, the early summer in the middle latitudes in this regard was favorable for them, I do not know whether the second or third generation is now with them this year.

Crimea is only a small part of its permanent habitat (where pupae safely overwinter) and it has a place to fly (unlike Acherontia atropos and Daphnis nerii, which hardly and unevenly survive the winter only in the very south). In addition, we do not expect bindweed hawkmoth arrivals in the fall – these will be local descendants of migrants (of whom there are always a few and therefore they are rare in fees) who arrived in the summer. And the number of autumn butterflies, therefore, depends both on the fertilized females that have flown to us from the south, and on the success of CTP development "in the field".

This post was edited by Aaata - 29.08.2012 14: 54

Crimea is only a small part of its permanent habitat (where pupae safely overwinter) and it has a place to fly (unlike Acherontia atropos and Daphnis nerii, which hardly and unevenly survive the winter only in the very south). In addition, we do not expect bindweed hawkmoth arrivals in the fall – these will be local descendants of migrants (of whom there are always a few and therefore they are rare in fees) who arrived in the summer. And the number of autumn butterflies, therefore, depends both on the fertilized females that have flown to us from the south, and on the success of CTP development "in the field".

The academic quality of your knowledge is amazing. Question for all participants: has anyone caught a bindweed hawk moth in the middle zone in spring or in the first half of summer? Neither I nor any of my acquaintances had ever encountered a bindweed hawk moth at that time. While in the fall (from the end of August) we observe the bindweed hawk moth regularly. Therefore, the version of the autumn flight from the south seems more realistic to me.

If it was noticed, then niyaz and I were just figuring out what could be collected in the Ryazan region in the fall and with what probability, while neither I nor, as I understand it, were there , i.e. the discussion was "in theory" for the entire middle zone of European Russia, which was an idea initially ungrateful, given the scale of the territory and the variety of climatic and biotopic conditions. .

As for the "probability of meeting", it is really a thankless task. It is better to talk about this in topics about Red Books. http://molbiol.ru/forums/index.php?showtop...%ED%F1%EA%EE%E9
But you were the first to start talking about it, even though no one asked you to. Initially, the question was what species can be caught in the fall in the Ryazan region. And whether you catch them or not will depend on the correct choice of biotope, on luck at last. And by the way, the list of lepidoptera of the Ryazan region has already been compiled on this forum http://molbiol.ru/forums/index.php?showtop...%ED%F1%EA%E0%FF

This post was edited by niyaz - 29.08.2012 21: 46

The academic quality of your knowledge is amazing. Question for all participants: has anyone caught a bindweed hawk moth in the middle zone in spring or in the first half of summer? Neither I nor any of my acquaintances had ever encountered a bindweed hawk moth at that time. While in the fall (from the end of August) we observe the bindweed hawk moth regularly. Therefore, the version of the autumn flight from the south seems more realistic to me.

Your survey won't tell you anything. And so it is clear that catching a migrant is a rare success: few people fly, spread out over a huge territory, their condition after a multi-hundred-kilometer flight is deplorable, laying eggs, they soon die before they have time to check in with our DRL).

What I outlined in the previous post and repeated in more detail now is a long-known fact and there is no need to build "versions". I can cite literature sources that say in unison in black and white, based on numerous observations, and not speculation, that migrating hawkmoth (not just bindweed, by the way) appear in the middle zone in the summer (in more southern regions already from May) and that our local generation has time to develop one that is more suitable for the species. in September, we observe it with sufficient regularity. If that doesn't convince you, then try answering the following questions. Where do the caterpillars of the bindweed hawk moth come from, which are found in our country in summer and are very noticeable on forage plants in July and August at an older age? Or have you never met them? Have you ever thought that almost all autumn specimens are in too good and fresh condition, which is impossible after long-distance and long flights?

Well, I can say one thing on this issue.On August 14, 2011, in the evening, one yazykan was caught at Phlox
, four more, and on September 13, another one.All were in perfect condition.I also found a shell-shocked bindweed on a bush.Sotoyanie is also not bad.But that year it was warm at this time.It's raining every day now, and even the thistles have dried up in the fields (a drought before that).

Your survey won't tell you anything. And so it is clear that catching a migrant is a rare success: few people fly, spread out over a huge territory, their condition after a multi-hundred-kilometer flight is deplorable, laying eggs, they soon die before they have time to check in with our DRL).

What I outlined in the previous post and repeated in more detail now is a long-known fact and there is no need to build "versions". I can cite literature sources that say in unison in black and white, based on numerous observations, and not speculation, that migrating hawkmoth (not just bindweed, by the way) appear in the middle zone in the summer (in more southern regions already from May) and that our local generation has time to develop one that is more suitable for the species. in September, we observe it with sufficient regularity. If that doesn't convince you, then try answering the following questions. Where do the caterpillars of the bindweed hawk moth come from, which are found in our country in summer and are very noticeable on forage plants in July and August at an older age? Or have you never met them? Have you ever thought that almost all autumn specimens are in too good and fresh condition, which is impossible after long-distance and long flights?

Perhaps this may seem surprising to you, but I have not met the caterpillars of the loach hawk moth either. Let me change the question: Has anyone met a loach hawk moth, an imago or a larva (caterpillar) in the middle zone in spring or summer? So far, no one has answered that they have met in person. And I advise you, until you are personally convinced of something, you do not need to categorically state this, do not really trust the old or new books that copy information from the old ones. Have you seen any fresh thistles in the spring? I quite often, and they and flyers are much worse and fly more than necessary loach.

So far, I can say the following about this discussion.
Yes, neither death's head nor bindweed are known in the spring and early summer in the middle zone. But earlier, when there were huge potato fields, caterpillars and pupae of M. head were sometimes found, starting from the end of July. So there were flights after all - we can cover negligibly little space and time with observations.
And convolvulus from the end of July and later are sometimes in a significant number and perfect preservation. I don't know about the finds of their caterpillars either. But if they are stray, then they were bred certainly not in the Crimea, but not very far away-probably in the south of the forest-steppe-approximately starting from Lipetsk-Kursk.
Yazykan and euphorbia in the Tula region are regularly caught since the end of May, but the first generation is clearly stray, not in the best condition. Although their caterpillars (much more often euphorbia) are regularly found in autumn, but the pupae probably still freeze out .- "warming" is still insufficient, there are also frosts.

Perhaps this may seem surprising to you, but I have not met the caterpillars of the loach hawk moth either. Let me change the question: Has anyone met a loach hawk moth, an imago or a larva (caterpillar) in the middle zone in spring or summer? So far, no one has answered that they have met in person. And I advise you, until you are personally convinced of something, you do not need to categorically state this, do not really trust the old or new books that copy information from the old ones. Have you seen any fresh thistles in the spring? I quite often, and they and flyers are much worse and fly more than necessary loach.

Apparently, you don't have any arguments.

I found a semi-dead caterpillar of a bindweed hawk moth in early August in the Nizhny Novgorod region. At the same point in September, non-individual freshest butterflies are born.

Ask Penzyak,a or see about the loach caterpillars in the Ryazan region and pupae in the Penza region. his posts are here in the topic Sphingidae. He was collecting material on hawkmoth for a large article, which may have already been published.

Taking into account the information in scientific publications, this is quite enough for me.

You advise me to "trust but verify".. Strange. You "doubt", and I check .
Do you want to know 100% and confirm that there are migrants flying here in September? I see only one way with your approach: go to the south, mark as many butterflies there as possible and wait for them at home. If you have even 1 copy, I will assume that you are right, in violation of all the rules of statistical analysis and representativeness.
Otherwise, it turns out to be a meaningless conversation.
PS In the example about who is easier to get rid of during migration, burdock or hawkmoth, everything is exactly the opposite. It is the hawk moth that, due to the speed, frequency of strokes and morphological features (an abundance of easily knocked down scales on the thorax and abdomen), will receive damage much earlier. Since you have to check everything yourself, put a hawk moth and a nymphalid in an empty room – the result will not be long in coming. By the way, other strays (early euphorbias and yazykans) are broken for some reason, or do you think they come from Australia? In addition, I have repeatedly observed bindweeds in their "homeland" (Yalta, Sochi, Tuapse), including in the "harvest" years,and I came across perfect specimens only at the beginning of their summer, after 1.5-2 weeks almost all were broken.

По Rolf Reinbardt, Kurt Hanz: Wandernde Schwarmerarten, 1989

The permanent habitat zone is highlighted in black (here it is polyvoltine, the number of generations is determined by weather conditions, and the optimal development from egg to adult is about a month). Dotted line at the top - where it can reach. As you can see, even the extreme south of Russia and Ukraine does not fall into the zone of permanent habitat, because in cold winters pupae freeze out here. To the north, where winter frosts are mandatory for 20-25 years, pupae of this subtropical species cannot survive the winter.

If you have more recent information, I would be grateful. Moreover, for more than 20 years, warming/settling down could make adjustments.

I apologize, the messages probably need to be transferred to the hawk moth.

This post was edited by Aaata - 30.08.2012 20: 14

Pictures:

______A.convolvuli.jpg — (4.15мб)

Apparently, you don't have any arguments.

I found a semi-dead caterpillar of a bindweed hawk moth in early August in the Nizhny Novgorod region. At the same point in September, non-individual freshest butterflies are born.

Yes, just great! A vivid example of the expression: "There is my opinion and the wrong one." Congratulations! With this approach, it is unlikely that you will have meaningful discussions. I no longer respond to answers with this approach. Just the facts. What we have: the half-dead August caterpillar you saw. Now I doubt that this is a fact. In a previous post, you mockingly stated: "Where do the caterpillars of the convolvulus hawk moth come from, which are found in our country in summer and are very noticeable on forage plants in July and August at an older age? Or have you never met them?" And it turns out that you have one half-dead caterpillar as this fact… Laurel here, too, does not know the facts of catching a loach or finding caterpillars in spring and summer. And unlike you, he knows how to conduct a competent discussion. In which (just in case) the truth can be born. This does not apply to the discussion with you.

 
Ask Penzyak,a or see about the loach caterpillars in the Ryazan region and pupae in the Penza region. his posts are here in the topic Sphingidae. He was collecting material on hawkmoth for a large article, which may have already been published.

In the report of Penzyak,a there is not a single fact proving the arrival of convolvulus in the spring. All that it says is that in the Ryazan region found caterpillars loach. The question is when? Again you "distort"

 
Taking into account the information in scientific publications, this is quite enough for me.
You advise me to "trust but verify".. Strange. You "doubt", and I check .
Do you want to know 100% and confirm that there are migrants flying here in September? I see only one way with your approach: go to the south, mark as many butterflies there as possible and wait for them at home. If you have even 1 copy, I will assume that you are right, in violation of all the rules of statistical analysis and representativeness.
Otherwise, it turns out to be a meaningless conversation.
PS In the example about who is easier to get rid of during migration, burdock or hawkmoth, everything is exactly the opposite. It is the hawk moth that, due to the speed, frequency of strokes and morphological features (an abundance of easily knocked down scales on the thorax and abdomen), will receive damage much earlier. Since you have to check everything yourself, put a hawk moth and a nymphalid in an empty room – the result will not be long in coming. By the way, other strays (early euphorbias and yazykans) are broken for some reason, or do you think they come from Australia? In addition, I have repeatedly observed bindweeds in their "homeland" (Yalta, Sochi, Tuapse), including in the "harvest" years,and I came across perfect specimens only at the beginning of their summer, after 1.5-2 weeks almost all were broken.

Here you have mixed so much speculation into one pile that there is not the slightest desire to rout***. Tip: Use facts. It seems that it is important for you to prove your opinion, and it does not matter whether it is correct or not. I don't care if the bindweeds come to us in spring or autumn, or if they can spend the winter here at all. I want to know for sure. This requires facts.

sdi
Permanent member
Moscow
today, 08: 22 URL #23

...I don't care if the bindweeds come to us in spring or autumn, or if they can spend the winter here at all. I want to know for sure. This requires facts.
=========================================
Published fact in favor of episodic spring loach flights and development here-right in Tula at the beginning (I think) of September 2000. "more than 30 specimens were recorded, of which about 80% were perfectly preserved females, which indicates that they were bred not very far from here." More precisely, about this-in the collection " Biological Diversity of the Tula Region... "(2001) - it is not available in electronic form, but in Moscow libraries there is. About half of them were caught - the collector put them in boxes and sold them, only 1 was presented to the local history museum, where I then received a salary. Unpublished fact: at the end of August 2007, several specimens were not found in the Suvorovsky district. (more precisely, to raise the records again, not mine), but a little grated - despite the fact that this year we caught a lot of light in other places, but did not mark it. In the first case, there is a hotbed very close to the place of capture, in the second - also somewhere within the area (if it was a mass flight from the south, it would be marked widely across the territory).
As for the wintering conditions, you should look at the book Danner et al., 1998 - but it probably isn't available in libraries in Moscow - I once took it to read. If memory serves, the pupa freezes when the frost is below 8 deg. - that is, it does not always overwinter in the Crimea.

Laurel here, too, does not know the facts of catching a loach or finding caterpillars in spring and summer.

In the Crimea, I do not recall a bindweed in the first half of summer. They appear and fly en masse in August and September.
Caterpillars are found in September-October, and in some years they can be in large numbers.

sdi
Permanent member
Moscow
today, 08: 22 URL #23

...I don't care if the bindweeds come to us in spring or autumn, or if they can spend the winter here at all. I want to know for sure. This requires facts.
=========================================
Published fact in favor of episodic spring loach flights and development here-right in Tula at the beginning (I think) of September 2000. "more than 30 specimens were recorded, of which about 80% were perfectly preserved females, which indicates that they were bred not very far from here." More precisely, about this-in the collection " Biological Diversity of the Tula Region... "(2001) - it is not available in electronic form, but in Moscow libraries there is. About half of them were caught - the collector put them in boxes and sold them, only 1 was presented to the local history museum, where I then received a salary. Unpublished fact: at the end of August 2007, several specimens were not found in the Suvorovsky district. (more precisely, to raise the records again, not mine), but a little grated - despite the fact that this year we caught a lot of light in other places, but did not mark it. In the first case, there is a hotbed very close to the place of capture, in the second - also somewhere within the area (if it was a mass flight from the south, it would be marked widely across the territory).
As for the wintering conditions, you should look at the book Danner et al., 1998 - but it probably isn't available in libraries in Moscow - I once took it to read. If memory serves, the pupa freezes when the frost is below 8 deg. - that is, it does not always overwinter in the Crimea.

Thanks for the information. Quite fresh convolvulus are caught in the Moscow region in the fall. Moreover, at dusk on phlox and sweet tobacco, as for example at Roman's dacha near Beloomut, it happens that a lot of them fly, but not one comes to the light. From my observations, I can say that they came to the light closer to the end of the night (deep after 2 hours), by this time almost everyone finishes catching and may not see this hawk moth. In general, hawkmoth, in addition to being excellent fliers, they also persist for quite a long time. The same convolvulus caught dozens in the Elbrus region in the last days of October - not a single grated one. And the report of a large number of fresh females near Tula is not a very strong fact that they were bred somewhere nearby. It would be good to collect statistics on the finds of caterpillars or butterflies in spring and summer.
In general, I observed a picture when in the Astrakhan region ruled hawkmoth flew en masse one night, but the rest of them were not. I got the impression that it was us who hooked the "migratory flock".

Apparently, you don't have any arguments.

I found a semi-dead caterpillar of a bindweed hawk moth in early August in the Nizhny Novgorod region. At the same point in September, non-individual freshest butterflies are born.

Ask Penzyak,a or see about the loach caterpillars in the Ryazan region and pupae in the Penza region. his posts are here in the topic Sphingidae. He was collecting material on hawkmoth for a large article, which may have already been published.

Taking into account the information in scientific publications, this is quite enough for me.

You advise me to "trust but verify".. Strange. You "doubt", and I check .
Do you want to know 100% and confirm that there are migrants flying here in September? I see only one way with your approach: go to the south, mark as many butterflies there as possible and wait for them at home. If you have even 1 copy, I will assume that you are right, in violation of all the rules of statistical analysis and representativeness.
Otherwise, it turns out to be a meaningless conversation.
PS In the example about who is easier to get rid of during migration, burdock or hawkmoth, everything is exactly the opposite. It is the hawk moth that, due to the speed, frequency of strokes and morphological features (an abundance of easily knocked down scales on the thorax and abdomen), will receive damage much earlier. Since you have to check everything yourself, put a hawk moth and a nymphalid in an empty room – the result will not be long in coming. By the way, other strays (early euphorbias and yazykans) are broken for some reason, or do you think they come from Australia? In addition, I have repeatedly observed bindweeds in their "homeland" (Yalta, Sochi, Tuapse), including in the "harvest" years,and I came across perfect specimens only at the beginning of their summer, after 1.5-2 weeks almost all were broken.

In the south of mainland Ukraine (Zaporizhia region) almost every year, solitary loach hawks are observed in June-July, massively in August-October.

I have repeatedly caught imago of bindweed hawk moth at the beginning of the summer, and in general, there are a lot of them here! This refers to the beginning of June. I don't understand what prevents them from flying north.

Personally, I saw the bindweeds (not very much) in Khost (south of Sochi) at the very beginning of June 1983. I was not particularly in the south at that time, but I will try to look at the recordings. It's not very fast to search for it.

The author of the topic probably got the full answer to his question. For more information, see Sphingidae.

The author of the topic probably got the full answer to his question. For more information, see Sphingidae.

Yes, thank you, I read it. It is written convincingly and logically. Perhaps this is similar to the truth.
The only thing that leaves doubts is that no one pointed out the presence of spring-summer convolvulus in the middle zone. The version of the Laurel still has the right to exist, namely the autumn flight of butterflies from the south of central Russia. Interestingly, Andrey Elez himself met butterflies / caterpillars of loach in the spring / early summer in the Moscow region. He's already gone through our region up and down, and if he hasn't met us yet... I'll have to remember to ask him at the convention.

I almost never specifically looked for preimaginals, and I didn't come across convolvuli caterpillars along the way, because there was no place for them to come from, so I had to examine the food plants specifically.

Imagos in the Odessa region flew to me (Ovidiopolsky district, the left bank of the Dniester river just north of the Black Sea coast) from the last days of May in huge numbers to the light, safety from luxury to almost luxury. They flew simultaneously with the first generation of ligustri, with the remaining saturnium pyri, and so on. On Taman, convolvuli I came across supermass both at dusk and at night in the light, and during the day flying along the slopes of the mountains on the northern coast, but I don't remember the exact dates now, I'll let you know later.

On the Black Sea coast of the Western Caucasus, imagos came across in large numbers of very different preservation - from luxury to complete rags, because there imagos can fly away from the place of brood in a few seconds to feed in several climatic zones, and even within the subtropics (from the coast to the top of the city of Akhun at least), the difference in the timing of the onset of spring is considerable thanks to this, both local old people and mountain youth feed at the same time on the shore in June and July. In general, the altitudinal range of the species, which I have noted for several years , is from the coast to 2242 m above sea level, from the alps, where the snow has not yet fallen everywhere, to oleanders and palm trees. Such a hawk moth is no wonder to cross the same zonal boundaries on the plane, only it will take more time and, accordingly, feeding.

For the information of those who doubt the pendulum migration of the species, I will add that in our autumn it is either satisfactorily preserved or luxury, I don't know the other yet. Where it can be developed all year round, it can be a complete mess, but in our country-never (I say this according to information not only from my own and two forum participants, but also from other people). I can only explain this by saying that in the autumn we see exclusively suckers who were just born somewhere around here, who live and feed for a maximum of several days and who will soon disappear from our field of vision. Some might be stuck here long enough to skin their wings, even before the snowfall, but these are exceptions that fall out of the general instinctive program of the species.

In general, the old literature does not often lie, it's just that the old people did not always record specific cases with the meticulousness that would satisfy us today, considered it sufficient that they received and announced their conclusions, and did not think that each new generation would doubt the conclusions and demand them for some lie in the future. confirm experimentally for the hundredth time, always based on the presumption of guilt of the past recipient of conclusions. Science needs to move forward and higher, and not jump up and down with an eternal return to the same point. For example, they did not describe the list of cases of meetings and instead of a mountain of labels gave the reader the final wording - that the butterfly flies there and at such and such a time. But this does not necessarily mean that the facts were not behind the result and that the result was far-fetched. Yes, in my opinion, this is not so old information - about the migration of convolvuli.

Personally, I saw the bindweeds (not very much) in Khost (south of Sochi) at the very beginning of June 1983. I was not particularly in the south at that time, but I will try to look at the recordings. It's not very fast to search for it.

Khosta is a microdistrict in Sochi. And yes, there are more than enough loach trees in Sochi.

I've been fishing for the last three weekends.In the first two days, 2 pieces, in the second zero, and in the last 60 pieces, 10-12 types, maybe more, if I don't write any interesting ones (I haven't straightened them out yet).On hawkmoth: once at sunset, on pitunyakh the hawkmoth, toli podmarenikovy, toli malochayny fed.I was without a net, the hawk moth was gone.He looked very shabby.In all that time, there was no one else.Everything is a trifle.Several blue and red ribbon boxes.The rest of the nail)))

I've been fishing for the last three weekends.In the first two days, 2 pieces, in the second zero, and in the last 60 pieces, 10-12 types, maybe more, if I don't write any interesting ones (I haven't straightened them out yet).On hawkmoth: once at sunset, on pitunyakh the hawkmoth, toli podmarenikovy, toli malochayny fed.I was without a net, the hawk moth was gone.He looked very shabby.In all that time, there was no one else.Everything is a trifle.Several blue and red ribbon boxes.The rest of the nail)))

The rest of the lines after the first sentence could not be written)))

Over the past two days, only a couple of confuses, one xestia and one Limois emeljanovi have flown in. Even erannisses don't fly

I have a question about autumn fishing. Where is the best place to look for late-autumn moths: in steppe areas, or where there are more trees? Or maybe on the sandy steppe? Search when it gets dark or during the day?

I have a question about autumn fishing. Where is the best place to look for late-autumn moths: in steppe areas, or where there are more trees? Or maybe on the sandy steppe? Search when it gets dark or during the day?

It depends on the specific type of moth.

I have a question about autumn fishing. Where is the best place to look for late-autumn moths: in steppe areas, or where there are more trees? Or maybe on the sandy steppe? Search when it gets dark or during the day?

Probably not anywhere else this year.