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"Childish" beetles identificatoin errors

Community and Forum → Taxonomy. Classification → "Childish" beetles identificatoin errors

amara, 25.01.2008 11:28

I want to share, maybe someone will be interested.
I had such a case recently, the collection was replenished with several beetles that looked exactly like Donacia (once already defined ) and I used the 2nd volume of ONEcHSSR ("green") immediately began to determine the species. Not that it was very easy, but without much difficulty, I brought these beetles to 3 different species. Then, with some surprise, I find out that one of these species has not been observed in the territory where they were caught before and it would be nice to check the definition. With pleasure, I take these beetles out of the box, examine them carefully, and well, so it is in those beetles that I defined as Donacia antiqua, the suture at the top of the elytra is turned out and therefore they belong to the genus Plateumaris. That's how my mother's laziness and overconfidence put me, a newcomer to this group, on the wrong track. And it all looked so similar.
Well, Plateumaris so Plateumaris, I have a couple of beetles from this genus (those marked immediately on the turned seam), I determine the species. Two immediately approach discolor, one to sericea, and the fourth seems to "hang" between these species, the color of the legs is like that of one, the size of the segments of the antennae is like that of another, and the shape of the anterior corners of the pronotum generally occupies an intermediate position. I even wondered if it was a hybrid between the two species. Later, in the list of leaf beetles of the Leningrad region, P. Romantsev found that transitional forms between these types were also observed by others. And on a great site http://www.biol.uni.wroc.pl/cassidae/Europ...plateumaris.htm, where there are images of all European species of leaf beetles, in general, the first species stands as a sinom of the second. I wonder what others who have encountered this think about these two types.

Comments

25.01.2008 12:14, алекс 2611

When I started tinkering with leaf beetles, I also heroically placed all Plateumaris in the genus Donacia. I quickly realized that it turns out some garbage. The pendulum immediately swung in the other direction. Identified Donacia impressa as Plateumaris.
Finally, I calmly figured it out and now I don't seem to confuse these two types.

discolor and sericea seem to be different from each other. I don't have any transition forms in my fees. However, there is not much material on this group. For the 2008 season in my priority scale, rainbows and cryptocephaluses are in the first place. I will collect a lot and everywhere. In the fall, we will talk about these two types.
Likes: 1

25.01.2008 13:21, amara

You certainly know Alex, this list of leaf eaters of the Leningrad region, cat. I mentioned:
http://www.zin.ru/ANIMALIA/COLEOPTERA/rus/chrysspb.htm
Yes, and if we take only one trait (out of three), the relative length of the segments of the antennae, as was done in A. Y. Isaev (2007), then the problem with these species seems to disappear. Although not quite, I have a beetle with the maximum body size of one species falls on the signs of antennae in another.

This post was edited by amara - 25.01.2008 13: 30

25.01.2008 13:34, Alexandr Rusinov

I have quite a lot of material on Plateumaris from the Yaroslavl region, but only 2 copies are unconditionally drawn to sericea, the rest, in my opinion, is defined as discolor. Although this is my opinion, Elizar defines them all as sericea, and we have not come to a common opinion. In the determinant of Benkovsky's leaf beetles, these species are given separately, but a footnote is given that some consider them synonyms, so apparently one or two species is still free to decide for themselves.
Likes: 2

25.01.2008 13:44, amara

Well, interspecific hybridization, sorry for the naive question, is excluded?

This post was edited by amara - 25.01.2008 13: 45

25.01.2008 13:54, Alexandr Rusinov

Well, at least no genital differences between these species are given, apparently it depends on their own decency smile.gif. By the way, the identification table of Donacia and Plateumaris is in the identification of water beetles posted on the ZIN website, and "green" does not shine with a good table for these genera

This post was edited by Anthrenus - 01/25/2008 13: 58
Likes: 1

25.01.2008 17:37, amara

I asked about the interspecific hybrid because out of only 4 beetles (Istr. r-on, Moscow region,), two are clearly one species, the third is clearly another, and the fourth, no less clearly in half between these species, well, just like Mendelian splitting when crossing. But, in fact, this is only the assumption of a non-specialist.

This post was edited by amara - 25.01.2008 17: 47

25.01.2008 18:11, алекс 2611

I looked at my fees again. Yeah, it's a sad picture. I remember when I was defining it, the list of Pavel Romantsov you quoted was sitting in my head. And he writes that we have in the Leningrad region entirely discolor, and sericea is almost absent. So I unconsciously "played along" with the discolor version. That's what I got from Flax.areas are entirely discolors
and so there are indeed instances of a transitional appearance.
But they are all different from the Moldavian beetles collected by Ripper. Andrey brought clearly defined sericea from Moldova, but we don't have them.
Likes: 1

26.01.2008 9:39, Dmitry Vlasov

Plateumaris species have two pairs of "species", which some experts consider different, and the other forms of one or synonyms. This is a pair of discolor-sericea and rustica-affinis. To find out questions about these types, you need large series from different parts of the series. No one wants to get busy???

This post was edited by Elizar - 26.01.2008 12: 11
Likes: 3

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