We need insects of the same species from different populations

It seems to me that the D. melanogaster lines that are easiest to find are the lines. That is, unless you take two different lines. So that they have different origins. And they also differ from each other, not only in eye color, etc., but also in viability. Would that suit you?" Well, or take wild-type lines. For example, Canton S and Oregon R. The first one is a lot of places. Second — I don't know, we don't have.

And they also differ from each other, not only in eye color, etc., but also in viability. Would that suit you?"

No. Absolutely not satisfied. I need seven groups in order to take measurements seven times for the same exposure. And compare with the eighth control group on which the effect was not carried out. Then a one-factor analysis of variance is performed. That is, intra-group and inter-group variances are compared (between the control group and the affected groups).

And I will compare exactly viability and fecundity. That is, it will be a dependent variable in ANOVA.

And the factor (independent variable) will be the impact repeated seven times (for each group once).

So it doesn't suit me at all.

This post was edited by ihlindham - 18.03.2017 21: 20

I'm sorry, but what kind of impact are you going to have on the unfortunate insects? Given your fondness for the Dark Lord of all Molbiol, I'm beginning to think the worst. Otherwise, how to explain: the same effect on 7 unrelated groups, the control group is also not related to them, I would understand if you examined the populations that you have (for their characteristics). But you are looking. And don't care what.

Yes, in general, it's not my business what you do or how you do it. But there's something I can't understand about the scheme of your experiment. I am tormented by vague doubts.
You're not a biologist, are you, but a physicist? No matter how hard it turns out for you, as in the story that the teacher told us (students of departments from the physiological department) in practice in ornithology. In response to the whining "well, why do we need all this, we will do something completely different."
History. The physiologist has written his dissertation, the defense date is set, and it has already come to organizing a banquet. Subject: something about the sensitivity of different bird species to electric current. Here, quite by chance, the ornithologist took the abstract to read. Reads and fallot is stunned. He asks if this is serious? And did the dissertation student see how the pigeon and sparrow walk? As it turned out, the bird was fixed so that only one leg was free. And it was electrocuted. The conclusion about the insensitivity of sparrows to the current was made on the basis of the fact that the pigeon's paw was pulled away, but the sparrow was not...

That's what I mean. Are you going to set up several experiments, in each of which the experimental animals will be different from each other? And the control animals will be different from all the experimental groups? Or did I misunderstand you?"

 
You're not a biologist, are you, but a physicist?

Well, why not ? My second higher education is a university degree in physiology. And I have publications in foreign scientific peer-reviewed periodicals on biophysics.

 
That's what I mean. Are you going to set up several experiments, in each of which the experimental animals will be different from each other? And the control animals will be different from all the experimental groups? Or did I misunderstand you?"

Several experiments in each of which animals (insects or ticks) will not differ from each other by the name of the species. And the control group will also have the same view. The only difference should be that within each group, animals are relatives (distant or not very important), and each group with other kinship ties should not be characterized. In other words, they must come from isolated areas or laboratories.

By the way, the eighth control group is generally not required. The role of the control group can be performed by each group of seven before exposure to insects. That is, I compare fecundity before and after exposure. Control is pre-exposure measurements.

This post was edited by ihlindham - 03/19/2017 12: 05

By the way, you gave me an idea. It is necessary to conduct, by and large, not a one-factor but a multi-factor analysis of variance. The second factor will be the difference in the origin of the groups. This factor may not make a contribution, but for data analysis to be correct, the description should be done in this way.

This post was edited by ihlindham - 03/19/2017 12: 04

  
By the way, the eighth control group is generally not required. The role of the control group can be performed by each group of seven before exposure to insects. That is, I compare fecundity before and after exposure. Control is pre-exposure measurements.

Oh, yes, I haven't explained yet that it's not all that simple. Which insects in the group will be exposed and which will not, and which part of the group will be measured in what way before and after exposure. Well yes I will not detail this already

Maybe you should look for cockroaches. Ordinary Prussians. There were rumors that they were extinct (yeah, because of GMOs and mobile phones ), but in St. Petersburg in student dorms they definitely are, infa 100%

Judging by your suggestion of drosophila, it turns out that the species belonging to the object of research is completely indifferent. This is very strange, considering your other statement about the practical application of this research in the field of biomethod pest control, which supposedly promises big profits. This is against whom or what you are going to fight with the help of drosophila, not against fruit?

Judging by your suggestion of drosophila, it turns out that the species belonging to the object of research is completely indifferent. This is very strange, considering your other statement about the practical application of this research in the field of biomethod pest control, which supposedly promises big profits... in your stream of consciousness. Otherwise, only some kind of phantasmagoria is seen.

I won't try to convince you otherwise. The fact is that I have absolutely no interest in convincing anyone of anything. Interpret the situation as you see fit

This is against whom or what you are going to fight with the help of drosophila, not against fruit?

Drosophila as a control agent is not personally interesting to me. What is it (or any other insect) used for? I need you to see if a little more carefully than you did, read what I have stated above.

..in the search for isolated populations, you will either have to make a good trip yourself, or cooperate with someone...

That's why I gave a request on the forum in order to find where I could buy the material... But apparently I wasted my time

This post was edited by ihlindham - 03/19/2017 15: 00

I won't try to convince you otherwise. The fact is that I have absolutely no interest in convincing anyone of anything. Interpret the situation as you see fit

Moreover, I am satisfied that my idea remained unclear as I am not interested in revealing the details and purpose of the research

If you are so strong in self-citation, then perhaps you can answer your own little-understood question to mere mortals? You are the only person present who, on the one hand, really understands it, and on the other hand, is really interested in solving it. I'm afraid entomologists can't reach the high level of your scientific thinking about the use of drosophila in a study devoted to "biological control agents". It is customary for them to study exactly the object that is planned to be used later for applied purposes. Because different insects, you know, have a lot of differences in very different areas of biology, which, very likely, will negate all the results obtained on a certain "left" object when trying to apply them to the "right" object. Although, perhaps, your investors are not aware of this, but then the research goes into the completely uninteresting area of breeding suckers. And about the factor plan, YES, you made a little mistake in the section.

And yes, the large numbers of insects required for statistical analysis can quickly be produced from a small number of insects, the purchase of which will not be too burdensome, by the combined efforts of mother nature and the experimenter himself, but, of course, only if the latter is competent in the relevant field.

And yes, "groups of insects of the same species that do not have common ancestors" according to modern provisions of the theory of evolution do not have the right to exist, so alas, your experiment in the current physical reality can only be mental.