Entomology and children

A familiar situation And where do you live?

IMHO, the main thing is not to interfere. If an entomologist speaks in a person , it can't be changed painlessly. Amateur or professional will come out-it's not so important anymore. Throw in a couple of books on the topic. In large cities, there are clubs attached to universities and museums. In St. Petersburg, kids from elementary school run to Kupriyanov. Home-grown ideas about the natural ethics of "is it right to kill defenseless fluttering butterflies" and so on can harm your child now.

This post was edited by Nilson - 18.09.2006 12: 44

Very recognizable situation
In fact, very often the interest in insects that arose at this age develops into a life's work (perhaps-the second profession, for the soul). An excellent option, by the way, is a guarantee that a person will never get bored with himself. So help and support, just like that!

Now - what exactly can be done for the child now. First, make sure that the collection is correct. That is, explain that the insect is pricked on a pin, straightened and put in a box, and the label is pinned (you will have to help with labeling up to 10 years old, the child may not be able to cope). It's also great to learn how to keep a field diary - even if it's the most primitive one at first. This, by the way, is also useful for studying-training of writing skills related to personal interest. Provide popular books, teach them to identify from atlases (pictures).

As for books. There is such an author - Pavel Iustinovich Marikovsky, who has many fascinating popular books about insects and spiders - specifically for younger schoolchildren. I especially recommend the book "Young entomologist" - there is, among other things, a description of the technique in a form accessible to children. The book is relatively old (1978), but it makes sense to search the Internet.
Another good thing for a child is the atlas "Butterflies "(Murzin, V. S. Butterflies Atlas: For children M. Tropa 1993), you can also try to find it on the Internet. These are images (color drawings) of the most recognizable diurnal butterflies and a brief description of each species. Just right for 8 years old.

If you are a Muscovite, then it would be good to take your young entomologist to the Moscow City Council (school of young scientists) on Kakhovka. The deputy director there is an entomologist, a very nice guy, interested in enthusiastic young scientists.

In general, encourage interest and consult. Raising a colleague is a good thing, and we will help you in any way we can

Another good thing for a child is the atlas "Butterflies "(Murzin, V. S. Butterflies Atlas: For children M. Tropa 1993), you can also try to find it on the Internet. These are images (color drawings) of the most recognizable diurnal butterflies and a brief description of each species. Just right for 8 years old.

I have this book in a scanned version, if anything.

Thank you All for the warm welcome and advice. Yesterday I couldn't get to the forum(something with the Internet), so please excuse the delay with the answers.

A familiar situation And where do you live?

I live in the city of Dolgoprudny. It is 4 km from Moscow.

In Moscow, at the Department of Entomology of Moscow State University, there is a circle, you can take them there, and at the same time you will form yourself

P.S. Spiders are not insects!

In Moscow, at the Department of Entomology of Moscow State University, there is a circle, you can take them there, and at the same time you will form yourself

P.S. Spiders are not insects!

Mm-hmm... Wow, I bought an encyclopedia of insects. There's a Bird-eating Spider on the title page!
MSU gud. I'll try to bring them together. Fortunately, there are still connections, however, with the Department of Mechanics and Mathematics. And I don't think I'll be able to learn it myself. I usually spend all my time at work from 8-00 to 20-00.So the wife will have to be educated. Fortunately, it does not work. And I on Forum polazhu, with your permission, I will read.
Thanks!
I'll ask you later how to make fun of butterflies and what to make fun of. We've already made a trail." way. We bought a box with a transparent lid of some enemy candies. Candy was fed to my wife-she likes such things. And the box was used for business. They put cotton wool in each cell. And on top of the cotton wool put various stick insects, hawkmoth, butterflies, bumblebees, etc. Closed with a transparent lid. The cotton wool presses the insects against the top transparent lid and so the insects keep their places. And on the back of the box (opaque side), we pasted the names of insects over each cell in which the insect is located. The box was taped around the edge so that it wouldn't open. Now you can turn the box as you want, and the insects do not fall off.

And by the way, after all, there is one insect-lover on the forum - Katya. Lena, she also had a topic about ladybirds... True, it is big - born in 1994.

Mdya. It's too far - both to Kakhovskaya and to Vorobyovy Gory. I think I'll talk to my friend from the junior high school - about the schedule (maybe it's still possible to carry it) and, if anything, an individual schedule. Then I'll drop you off in private.

It's real to carry. My wife doesn't work for me(I make enough money). And she is engaged in the hardest work-raising a child. I will be outrageously grateful for your help

My wife is very worried. We don't have a single child in the district with similar hobbies and therefore, friends are a problem. Now I'll have something to show her. Thank you all again for your participation.

It's probably funny that my entomologist friends (mostly amateurs) and I, including myself, had a fascination with insects only fueled by the lack of friends in childhood. All my entomological friends were 50 years older than me until recently

I am very grateful for your willingness to help. Thank you. I'll try it myself first. If you have any questions , I'll unsubscribe.

First you need to find out what exactly to try (i.e. the description).

It's probably funny that my entomologist friends (mostly amateurs) and I, including myself, had a fascination with insects only fueled by the lack of friends in childhood. All my entomology buddies were 50 years older than me until recently

Kashmar! Poor kid, what's waiting for him...
But seriously, I think we have the same situation. Children, especially boys, don't understand his interest. Why, the children, I'm no better myself. But I'm trying.

 
Even so?!
Well, that's all-we take it for upbringing! Such shots do not go through the streets in droves! By the way, this is just like me... however, at a slightly older age. Starting with the fifth grade, it was more interesting to talk about "smart" topics like biology with high school students than with their peers. But no one picked up at that moment, so for a long time entomological classes were at the level of amateur collecting...

I meant the psychological profile of the child, but not the knowledge. That is, he already has many of the character traits inherent in boys at the age of 13.

Where to start:
Well, then about problems with friends..
I never had any problems with my friends, I was always the same as everyone else. Also from childhood (even from kindergarten, and maybe even earlier, I don't remember when even the teacher threw me soldiers, which I was very happy about ). Problems with my friends started later, when I realized that those who surround me are too limited, that when I walk with them or sit in the yard, I turn into a jellyfish out of boredom, I feel terribly sleepy, and so on. The main thing is that the fewer people who know about this activity, the better, since people usually do not understand any collecting at all(although if you tell adults, they understand, I meant people of my age, generally from 13 to 25, usually so). Although at this age nothing terrible will happen, maybe even someone else will be interested, more entomologist friends - it's more interesting to live. It is better to explain to him that you simply should not impose your passion, do not talk to people about it in vain.

About the fact that it is developing rapidly-GREAT! Please assist him in this! Educate him so that he is not a fanatic entomologist, but that he develops versatile. Introduce them to the beautiful - music, art, literature (let them try a lot of different literature - from fairy tales to philosophy, they will definitely like something (you can start reading it to them if they don't want to, and when they find "their own" they will start) when he grows up and the difference in knowledge and understanding becomes obvious to him, he will most likely be interested in philosophy, as it will be interesting for him to become more detached from others in his mind. Also, do not forget about physical education (usually seeing the makings of scientists in their children, people begin to train them in this area in such a way that they completely forget about the body, thus "nerds" grow up, who remain underdeveloped.) Probably you have seen smart people, savants (on TV or in real life) who are very smart, but terribly frail, to avoid this-give it to the wrestling section or track and field (well, you can handle it), but not so much in professional sports (and the latter usually leads to bad results the consequence is that it quickly exhausts the body, often professional athletes have injuries, after which they leave the sport forever and become "fat rhinos", so it is better to avoid professional sports). Introduce them to music for a reason, too - they gave you classical or jazz music to listen to.. Let him learn to play something If your wife doesn't work, you can even try to master a self - help guide-she will understand and show her son, small classes of half an hour a day will be enough to master the simplest skills that will be very important in the future. Only art remains.. well, it's easier here - he's pretty good and draws or sculpts so much, but that's enough for now

Let's get back to entomology.
Tell him to try to spread the insects beautifully. Let it be rare or not enough to spread, but try to make not just a collection, but a masterpiece I assure you that 5 beautifully spread "bugs" look much more beautiful than a few boxes carelessly packed with a bunch of insects.
Make him the necessary equipment (either when you read in the book, or if you find information on the Internet). To begin with, at least foam straighteners for butterflies, grasshoppers, dragonflies and other things with wings, a net (the net is full of information about them) and a stain. Yes, and it is also desirable to make mattresses (they are very easy to make), so that the material slowly accumulates - when it learns to identify better, it will find a lot of interesting new species that it could previously consider ordinary.

Well, these are the main components.
And, probably, it is better - the love and understanding of parents Should help him in everything, help him, give him as much time as possible, despite the work and fatigue, otherwise these years will pass and he will not have enough missed affection and care (since one mother's care is not enough), it is necessary not only to do for him something, but also spend time with him (such memories will remain for the rest of your life).

Bolivar:
Please do not give me a foul for such a large number of deviations from entomology Thank you

Where to start:
Well, then about problems with friends..
I never had any problems with my friends, I was always the same as everyone else.

That's why it wasn't, because it looked like everyone else. IMHO, children (and all people regardless of age) are very distrustful, to put it mildly, of those who are "different from us". At best- "we won't play with you", at worst - "on your nose".

Therefore, in parentheses, I indicated the "approximate" age limits when it is better not to talk about your hobbies (since even not such music can lead to this.. And an example of this is my love for metal, once I didn't understand this music myself - my brain couldn't stand it and everything, I only heard the thud and roar.. But as time passed and my brain was able to take in more, then I heard all the rich sounds and I liked metal.. Most people are at the level where metal sounds like a thump and a roar, so they don't understand what I liked about this music, sometimes they joke, sometimes they argue that this music is*****, but we should act more wisely - don't tell anyone, don't impose on anyone..)

In one system, there is a psychological technique that is very easy to master, but simple to use, it works very well-everyone will agree (tactfully of course ) People think that you support them, but inwardly you laugh at how well you circumvent your finger, people start to reach out to you, find a like-minded person. Thus, you make friends, surround yourself with a large social circle. And soon, no one forces each of them to be a good friend, go for walks, communicate a lot, etc. You just create a good opinion of yourself and live a calmer life.

A person needs plasticity to live - so you can be everything and look like everyone else

Where to start:

Thank you so much for such an interesting letter. I must admit
that I have a similar opinion with you on most problems. Especially regarding the fact that everything in a person should be harmoniously developed. That's what they taught us in karate. Now some comments:

If he does without communication, then this is not a bad thing. If there is no need, then it is not necessary to impose it. Friends will appear, and most likely, 1 is the best. Let me remind you that the best is not the one who does the same (I have a few friends who are involved in the same, but we have completely different views on life, that entomology is the only part that connects us (and then, I think, until I break away from them very much)). A good friend is someone who has a similar worldview, who perfectly understands actions and preferences. For a child like yours, a similar child will be a good friend. I have one from early childhood (8 months of life) with whom we are still the worst friends (almost like relatives). We just grew up side by side, were friends and understood each other, although we had different interests, but complemented each other with knowledge. I really had another very good friend when we lived in the Murmansk region for 2 years, but then after returning to Moldova, the connection disappeared, and the friendship was gradually forgotten..

Hobbies are not something to hide, you can tell your friends EVERYTHING, you can also tell adults, they understand, especially people of art and nature lovers. Various snobs, businessmen and others often do not want to understand anything at all, so it is useless for them to say something (and whether it is necessary, for what purpose!?).
Well, in general, the main thing is that they don't know what they can know, but when a person who does this constantly tells everyone about it, then the problems begin.

I understood about the psychological age. But knowledge is also needed, so books are just right. By the way, I can recommend more than just books.. There are special ones for brain training - super memory, super thinking, super reading, and so on. Such books help you better perceive and assimilate information, so there may not be any knowledge, but with such opportunities, it will be very easy and fast to get this knowledge.(to be honest, I want to master a couple myself, but I can't get my hands on it )

Don't get hung up on the fact that you don't understand anything about entomology, and you don't need to understand anything about names, species, taxonomy, etc.. Drkgoe case if you do not know how to craft, but this does not apply to entomology ). The same goes for beautiful straightening - there is no standard for beauty, but simetrically spreading the legs, and not leaving them to their own devices, also does not apply directly to entomology

Well, at the request of the way he started:
As a child, I loved animals, insects, and dinosaurs (I was afraid of spiders, for example, and someone else). In kindergarten, I just liked to hold various beetles in my hands, if I found cows , I planted them on indoor plants at home (I thought that they ate this). The first period of love ended when, back in the elementary years of kindergarten, the teacher brought me a soldier, I was very happy, I squeezed it in my hand, we were lined up in a row, and then I screamed - the soldier bit me. Well, then I was scared, for a while I tried to touch everyone in a row.. The second period ended not many years later, when he recruited ordinary small leaf eaters. I must have cut myself on the grass and blood ran down my palm, although I didn't feel anything. Opening my palm, I saw how these terrible creatures bit me until I bled, which I was very much afraid of and ran home in tears Such a cruel joke was played on me by nature, because small leaf beetles could not do anything like this. The third stage is when I got the first literature with a small number of images and Russian (mostly incorrect) names. talo is much more interesting to find in the nature of the already known bizarre nisayekomyh, even a couple of times collected them in a liter jar, but it didn't come to straightening out and they were outwitted there, in general, my mother threw them all out Well, and the main period began in the 5th grade. I was at a summer camp then. I was still interested in insects, I was fascinated by them, and we caught hornbills, rhinos, and all sorts of other beetles. There I saw the first morimus in my life, alpina, a gray long-whiskered one, but I didn't take them, because they were alive. Then I decided to collect only if I found dead beetles, the first of which was the big water lover.. then the hornet, then the May crunch, and then something else. Gradually collecting it all began to collect the living. This period can be roughly divided into 2, since I became seriously involved only 4 years ago - I started to determine, straighten out well, understand, etc.
The fact that your son can get all this knowledge, skills, and support now is GREAT! This is the dream of every entomologist! If you only knew how much we loaded up with friends about the fact that we didn't have any equipment (and even information wasn't available from where to get at least a little information), that there was no literature, that there were no knowledgeable acquaintances, and that was not so long ago.. Then your son is a lucky guy in this regard!

Yes, but I started with insects - so to speak, I moved from the particular to the general. True, I started late (relatively) - at the age of 13 and not with collections, but probably with reading Animal Life, although I somehow kept a dead bumblebee from 1989-I probably felt some craving then, but when my mother showed me a collection of butterflies there at VDNH in Moscow in 1990 and said - here is a person who collected all his life, I still remember my thought: and what did he spend his time on? I used to laugh at Cousin Benedict when I was reading The Fifteen-Year-Old Captain... so then the whole hobby, so to speak, started with a clean slate - well, then I switched from collecting and books about insects to more general biological ones, and now I've somehow cooled down to insects already-they so to speak turned out to be under the layer of everything else for me, although I have more interest in them than in other organisms.
Passion, in my opinion, is also not worth hiding - just don't flaunt it too much and talk about it with a smug look - because children, although they don't like people who are different from themselves, but they don't just put pressure on each other's personality traits. The border here, I think, is that if a child moves away from everyone and doesn't play with them all the time, it means he's not like them, and if he comes to them and says-here's who I caught, let's play, and then I'll show you-it means this it has a special feature. Well, that's about it.

  
Don't get hung up on the fact that you don't understand anything about entomology, and you don't need to understand anything about names, species, taxonomy, etc.. Drkgoe case if you do not know how to craft, but this does not apply to entomology ). The same goes for beautiful straightening - there is no standard for beauty, but simetrically spreading the legs, and not leaving them to their own devices, also does not apply directly to entomology

My hands are fine. And thanks to the charming Helene, I got books about insects and how and what to do(nets, stains, straighteners, etc.) so now there will be something to do on the weekend.

I was told that Sinev (a major moth specialist) came to ZIN as a pioneer and impressed everyone with his deep knowledge.

Of course, you need to encourage such a hobby, and then you will see who will become. Clearly not a doofus.

I was told that Sinev (a major moth specialist) came to ZIN as a pioneer and impressed everyone with his deep knowledge.

What's true is true.
And how he defended his doctorate...

This was my post.

The fact that the small one was bitten so hard is too bad.. you have to be more careful of me, of course, too, and bedbugs and hornets and bees and bumblebees (that's just spiders have not bitten yet ), but still you need to be careful - these things are not pleasant. Especially let him protect himself from predatory bedbugs, including gladyshes and the like - these are when they do their job, the hornets rest (in my opinion)

Let him straighten it out - and this work will be more than enough!
I just remembered that I used to draw like a fifteen - year-old in junior high school-the lines were clear and all that. My parents even wanted to take me to a special boarding school for viewing. Like the second Nadia Rusheva, not khukhry-mukhry (there was such a prodigy artist at the time). Thank God, they didn't get together
Later, just by the age of fifteen, my peers (ordinary, without artistic tattoos) caught up with me and overtook me: the technique is the same, and the pictures themselves are even more individual and funny.
And only in adulthood I realized what kind of talent was untimely withered - advanced development of fine motor skills, nothing else! And from where? Yes, butterflies! Pricked, straightened - that's how the little hands were trained!

The guy liked the book about the young entomologist. Thank you. The others haven't read it yet. But. This asshole ignored the school. The teacher already wrote me a note. I went to school. I had a difficult conversation. He says he stopped working in class and keeps climbing under the table. I had to punish the guy and limit his entomological development for a while. And then it was not enough for us to stay for the second year. Here are the cases. Just like me. He gets too involved.

The fact that the small one was bitten so hard is too bad.. you have to be more careful of me, of course, too, and bedbugs and hornets and bees and bumblebees (that's just spiders have not bitten yet ), but still you need to be careful - these things are not pleasant. Especially let him protect himself from predatory bedbugs, including gladyshes and the like - these are when they do their job, the hornets rest (in my opinion)

And who are predatory bedbugs? I hope in Mos. Obl. they are not found... But in general, his indifference to this case scares me myself.

I had to punish the guy and limit his entomological development for a while.

no need!!!
This is too cruel! Truth. Similarly, I remembered my 8 years: if I was completely weaned from butterflies, it would be very difficult (such as psychological withdrawal), and also very offensive.
It is necessary and quite simple to check the portfolio for the presence of an extra textbook there

In fact, everything is not so terrible: well, a person broke down, in a few days (as soon as he finished reading) everything could have resolved by itself.

Here, by the way, is a piece of news that you can use for a constructive conversation.
Dima thought about the education of a colleague and advised him to take him to Moscow State University to Bolivar: there, unlike the Moscow City University, there is not just a young scientist, but a special entomological circle. But the older guys are engaged there, so we must first meet (with Dima) and assess how much the eight-year-old will pull. So there is a reason to increase your motivation to study: to get a perspective in your field, you need to have a super level of general training: for seniors, so for seniors!

By the way, it would be very nice to forgive the outrageous person at least for the sake of visiting the exhibition of live insects - it happens once a year.

Yes, more info from Dima: if it works out with the entomological circle, then it will be possible to go to the Moscow region separately (regardless of participation in the circle) and watch/collect insects there with an adult supervisor.

You definitely don't need to be punished! He's not a kitten or a dog that needs to be poked in the face to make them understand. You need to explain to them in detail: Tell them that learning at school is very important. It provides not only knowledge for work, but also for life in general. So without this knowledge, he will not live. Also say that the big thing is that the brain begins to function much better - to remember, to think, which is reflected in the physical processes. Jokingly say: "you don't want to be unable to remember the names of butterflies later, where they are found, and what they look like in general."
If the punishment is so important, then approach the problem in a different way: You can say-you will not learn well - I will not make a net or something else, BUT then it will not become more interesting for him to work, and you will just drive him into a corner..
It is better to do so: If you study well and show interest in studying , I will buy a beautiful butterfly (and find a tropical butterfly in a frame in a store, or a butterfly on a pin somewhere). Then the incentive will be greater.
You can also introduce him to the warrior's philosophy (but it's probably a little early). For example, to say that a warrior performs perfectly any action in which he is involved is certainly not everything, but it is enough for this

"And who are predatory bedbugs?"
These are the ones that catch other insects and suck them out. Some of them probably have some kind of poison. Their proboscis is hard, sharp and pricks painfully. The largest of them are belostomy-I have one of them-I found it on the beach here in the sand (they say I was on the seashore because I migrated) - in length, in my opinion, up to 10 cm. But such people are definitely not found in the Moscow region. Gladyshs are water beetles, brownish ones that flounder in the water:
http://floranimal.ru/families/2918.html
In the Moscow region, probably there is. By the way, water skaters are also a predator and also a bug. There are also predators that can be recognized by the elongated head:
http://floranimal.ru/families/2915.html
But I don't think they bite as hard as RippeR says, even though I've never been bitten.
And you can also encourage your studies as Helene said: "to the elders so to the elders" - it is necessary to study in order to get there!

There are also predators that can be recognized by the elongated head:
http://floranimal.ru/families/2915.html
But I don't think they bite as hard as RippeR says, even though I've never been bitten.

Everyone, of course, has their own pain threshold, but the injection in carnivores (family Reduviidae) is quite painful.

and I and my friends were bitten by both reduvius and gladyshi and, personally, I did not experience anything more painful.. Even the hornet did not bring such pain (after the hornet, a large area hurt, but not so much, and with the predator, the pain was sharper, and the finger, when pressed, hurt for a couple of days )

By the way, what about their size? Up to 10 cm? I found that many consider the biggest predator to be 38 mm.. I am surprised by this size for bedbugs - 10 cm

These are the most normal sizes for belostomatids. They're also delicious. At least, that's what the Chinese think.

In my opinion, the Chinese consider everything that moves delicious

"In my opinion, the Chinese consider everything that moves delicious "
No fig to themselves - why are there so many of them? Well, they are not paralytics!
"These are the most normal sizes for belostomatids"
The one that I have is a little smaller - only 7 cm. But it still looks impressive, sorry photo no.

Belostoma

Ah!!!! These yes! I remembered! Thanks!

no need!!!
This is too cruel! Truth. Similarly, I remembered my 8 years: if I was completely weaned from butterflies, it would be very difficult (such as psychological withdrawal), and also very offensive.
It is necessary and quite simple to check the portfolio for the presence of an extra textbook there

Don't be afraid ;-) You've seen me, but I'm capable of hurting a person. Especially not his son. It's just that he spends a lot of time with insects. He looks at them, moves them from jar to jar. And in class, he doesn't think about otm. As a result, I started wearing deuces for my work in the classroom. Sasha takes offense at him. She called me to school. At home, he refuses to do his homework. Naturally, I do not forbid him to do what he likes, but simply limit him. And if possible, without physical effects. I have a quick understanding of him. In order to do something, he requires an explanation of why to do it and what will happen if he does not do it. As he says: ""I can't do without artachiniy" And at school the teacher doesn't have time to do explanations. She has 23 people and a plan. By the way, the teacher is so-so, on the C grade. I was more fortunate in this respect, as my teacher was young and loved children and her profession. And the whole class idolized her. And all the boys were planning to marry her.

Well, you didn't quite understand me, and physical development is definitely necessary (by the way, here you can start like this: in the morning, if you get up at the same time, "force" him to do push-ups, squats, pres swing at least a little. You then sit down a few times, then yes, it will not be difficult and will not take much time, but these few times will be in time for him. As for the sections , I don't recommend hand-to-hand combat or karate (one focuses on the hands, the other on the feet), it's better to give it to some kind of plastic martial art (I went to the Show-Dao myself. A very good system-it develops everything-mice, plastic surgery of all joints, they even push a certain philosophy( Very good), they give a certain practice of massage(in particular, self-massage for physical recovery), and in general there in sonovny the emphasis is not on a fight, but on improving the body and the effectiveness of the fight (the faster you coped - so much the better (even to the point (if the enemy is definitely not defeated), to hit the balls and flow )))). By warrior's philosophy, he meant accepting life as a struggle, not lying down while life assails you with its troubles. It also includes the effort to perfectly perform everything that you encounter in life, since a person has no option to do anything carelessly, to be subjected to some kind of suffering, since each suffering will be reflected in the future. (what gives us at least 1 physical exercise or brain strain-in the future (or when faced with a corresponding situation) we will see the benefits, and what will give suffering, unwillingness to have psychological endurance when the weight of circumstances rolls over-it slowly kills us (if you survived psychologically, then you survived). ("What doesn't kill us makes us stronger"))