Budding of colonies

There are no specialists in public insects?

There are no specialists in public insects?

Do you use prohibited psychological techniques?
I am not an expert, and I was not interested in the way of life of ants in detail, I can't say anything on the topic. Just note that ants have a very different way of life in different species, can you specify what kind of species we are talking about, F. rufa?

"Do you use prohibited psychological techniques?"
Just surprised a little... (in general, I know that it seems to be there
I actually meant how different insects solve this problem, not any particular species - after all, the solution mechanisms may differ. And the problem seems to be there.

So, in all females of the common stingy hymenoptera naskomyh, females mate once in a lifetime,only once, for life, tkrmitov not connect.this is a completely different group of insects.these are social cockroaches, insects with incomplete metamorphosis, in female ants, young winged queens mate once in a lifetime up to a dozen times, find a place to gnaw their wings,and establish a colony

Hunter, you write one thing in the first part of the message, and another in the second part : first, the fact that females of all stinging hymenoptera mate once in a lifetime, and then - that ants do this a dozen times? Termites - so everything is different for them: from the beginning to the end, the similarity is only superficial...
Still, what is the situation when there are no fertilized females in the kidney, or does this happen only when there are such females?

Hunter, you write one thing in the first part of the message, and another in the second part : first, the fact that females of all stinging hymenoptera mate once in a lifetime, and then - that ants do this a dozen times?

I understand that the female mates up to 12 times during the mating flight. Only it is not clear with one or more males.

Chromocenter, as far as I know, red ants already have fetal uterus crawling into a new colony, which is in excess in the mother colony, they get there after the mating summer, and I think foreign females are also accepted.
Forest red ants mate only during the summer, so there are simply no infertile wingless females in the anthill.
That is, there is no special problem at all.
In bees, males fly from spring to late autumn, there are no problems at all. I don't know many other social insects that breed in colonies.

Bad Den, a female with the same male is unlikely to mate more than once. Usually, after mating, the male dies. But again, it is necessary to specify the species in question.

I once read that the female of ants usually mates with several males during the summer: to make it more accurate, I guess. So the colony will bud only when the female is ready for reproduction the female is already there? It's clear...

yes, the female mates with several males,males in bees are disposable, in wasps and bumblebees they live for a long time, in ants 1 day

"males in bees are disposable"
of honeybees? and someone (from the eponyms, of course) - no? Wasps and bumblebees?

Years in ants just in order to avoid closely related interbreeding... However, there are species in which queens and males mate without departure, in their native nest, and they do not care about family ties

And what do they have, so each nest" in its own juice "knows exactly how many generations and"cooks"?

in natural conditions bees will not allow closely related interbreeding

Well, they do not cross the uterus with "their own drones" (most likely they are sons), but how to identify more distant relatives?

"males in bees are disposable"
of honeybees? and someone (from the eponyms, of course) - no? Wasps and bumblebees?

Well, about "disposable" males - this is somewhat categorical.

In many species of solitary stinging webs, males also mate several times and with different females.

And with public ones, not everything is so simple. A young female during the summer can mate sequentially with several males, accumulating sperm in the vas deferens, from where it subsequently enters for fertilization of eggs.

In addition, in some species (for example, the Pharaoh ant), several "queens"get along well in the nest.

Finally, do not overestimate the harmful effects of inbreeding on insects. For several years now, I have been monitoring a "family" of cockroaches called Periplaneta australasiae, descendants of a single female accidentally imported from Borneo. So many times they crossed paths there, but no negative impact has been noticed so far.

So you have them under surveillance, you feed them and protect them... (I think so), but in nature, life is different-it's harder there and what is not noticeable in the laboratory may be of critical importance there, but nothing can be said for sure. Inbreeding is also used in breeding new breeds, but if it takes place in nature and for hundreds or thousands of generations, it will lead to too large a dropout of non-viable individuals, in general, nothing good will come of it, except for fixing a couple of signs that the ancestors possessed. And males - well, especially lucky (i.e., probably competitive with others) can probably mate many times, but they don't live from one summer to another. Females-so this is understandable: it is preferable for them to mate with several - what if one "defective" will be? Strictly speaking, male perepons are degenerates - you can't really choose anything decent among them...

So you have them under surveillance, you feed them and protect them... (I think so), but in nature, life is different-it's harder there and what is not noticeable in the laboratory may be of critical importance there, but nothing can be said for sure. Inbreeding is also used in breeding new breeds, but if it takes place in nature and for hundreds or thousands of generations, it will lead to too large a dropout of non-viable individuals, in general, nothing good will come of it, except for fixing a couple of signs that the ancestors possessed...

.. Strictly speaking, the males of perepons are degenerates - you can't really choose anything decent among them...

Well, "supervised" means just feeding and periodic cleaning. There is no one to protect it from, but the laboratory conditions are still there. That's not what I was talking about. That in the case of insects, inbreeding may not always have a very detrimental effect on subsequent generations.

As for natural conditions, the probability of inbreeding exists only in isolated local populations. And the negative impact is also not 100%. It is quite possible, for example, the appearance of "clean lines".

But I could tell you a lot about male hymenoptera that would completely change your opinion about their "degeneracy".

Of course, inbreeding is not completely harmful! It only increases the probability of meeting undesirable alleles, and in the case when there is a certain "useful" recessive trait in the population, then inbreeding is only for the good, unless, of course, the saturation of harmful mutations in the heterozygous state is not too high, which, apparently, is more often the case with narrow ecological specialization, when the heterogeneity of the population is useless.
And I wrote about the" degeneracy " of males simply because they are haploid, therefore any mutation that the mother had in a heterozygous state manifests itself in them, and many of them, of course, "spoil" the body. But this, of course, is also not 100%.

.. And I wrote about the" degeneracy " of males simply because they are haploid, therefore any mutation that the mother had in a heterozygous state manifests itself in them, and many of them, of course, "spoil" the body. But this, of course, is also not 100%.

More precisely, when mutations in recessive alleles are inherited. So?

Yes it is.

in perepons, males, except for sex, are almost beztolkovye, but intersno in public wasps, when the nest is irritated, all males swarm around the intruder of rest, visually adding the size of the swarm

Well, creating hype is all the masters. In general, I also think that males are not suitable for anything other than mating. And it is clear why.

2 Bounty Hunter & Chromocenter

Both of you are very wrong, since you are only focusing on our public folding wings.
In real life, everything is much more diverse and interesting.

AVA, please tell me what's going on! Give us links, share your observations, and then we'll see what their males are cool and what they are capable of. but I've never heard of any males building a nest, raising larvae, or even carrying food to the nest. If you know any examples of this, please share them.

AVA, please tell me what's going on! Give us links, share your observations, and then we'll see what their males are cool and what they are capable of. but I've never heard of any males building a nest, raising larvae, or even carrying food to the nest. If you know any examples of this, please share them.

Well, perhaps the information I give below will be of interest to hymenopteran lovers. However, I will immediately make a reservation that it concerns single burrowing wasps, which not so long ago were considered in the rank of a single family (Sphecidae), and now, in the light of new phylogenetic data, are divided into at least 3.

Males of a number of species of the genus Philanthus (Crabronidae, Philanthini) after leaving the cells and mating can stay near the nest throughout their lives, spending the night in abandoned nests. There is an observation on the joint use of one nest by 2 females and 1 male of the genus Trachypus (Crabronidae, Philanthini).

Males of some species of the genus Palarus (Crabronidae, Palarini) have fixed mating territories, within which they not only search for females, but also drive out other males. Often, such guards "get" other intruders, including parasitic ones. There are observations of females and males spending the night together in incomplete nests.

A similar behavior is typical for males of some species of the genus Oxybelus (Crabronidae, Oxybelini), which also patrol the territory around the nest, attacking approaching parasites (wasps, miltogram flies) or other males of their genus. In some cases, the male stays with the female for the entire duration of nest construction.

In some species of the genus Cerceris (Crabronidae, Cercerini) that nest in colonies, females of the new generation can "help the mother" in protecting the common nest.

However, the most unusual behavior is shown by males of some species of the genera Dynatus (Sphecidae, Sceliphrini), as well as two related genera Pison and Trypoxylon (Trypargilum) (Crabronidae, Trypoxylini).

Males of some species of these genera can not only guard the nest while the female hunts, protecting it from intruders (although paying more attention not so much to parasites as to males and females of their own species). In the absence of a female, the male is either near the nest (Dynatus, Pison) or directly in the nest with his head out (Pison, Trypoxylon).

Males of some Trypoxylon species take prey from the female before entering the nest, and put it in the cell themselves, while the female continues hunting. There is even a report that Trypoxylon males can help the female by bringing portions of clay, and even inside the nest when making clay partitions.

It is also interesting that in the Pison and Trypoxylon species, whose males are constantly at or inside the nest, their presence is a necessary condition for the normal activity of the female. If for some reason the male is absent, the female stops filling the cells and leaves the nest.


Some links:

Antropov, A.V. 1990. Another nest guarding male of Pison // Sphecos, 19:20.

Bohart, R.M., Marsh P.M. 1960. Observations on the habits of Oxybelus sericeum Robertson (Hymenoptera: Sphecidae) // The Pan-Pacific Entomologist, 36:115-118.

Evans, H.E. 1973. Burrow sharing and nest transfer in the digger wasp Philanthus gibbosus (Fabricius) // Animal Behaviour, 21:302-308.

Evans, H.E., Matthews R.T. 1973. Observations on the nesting behavior of Trachypus petiolatus (Spinola) in Colombia and Argentina (Hymenoptera: Sphecidae: Philanthini) // Journal of the Kansas Entomological Society, 46(2):165-175.

Fattig, P.W. 1936. Nest building of Trypoxylon politiforme Roh. // The Canadian Entomologist, 68:44-45.

Grandi, G. 1961. Studi di un Entomologo sugli Imenotteri superiori // Bolletino dell’Istituto di Entomologia dell’Università di Bologna, 25:i-xv, 1-659.

Kimsey, L.S. 1978. Nesting and male behavior in Dynatus nigripes srombpinolae (Lepeletier) (Hymenoptera, Sphecidae) // The Pan-Pacific Entomologist, 54:65-68.

Masuda, H. 1939. Biological notes on Pison iwatai Yasumatsu (Hymenoptera, Trypoxylonidae) // Mushi, 12:114-146, pl. 4-5.

Paetzel, M.M. 1973. Behavior of the male Trypoxylon rubrocinctum (Hymenoptera: Sphecidae) // The Pan-Pacific Entomologist, 49:26-30.

Rau, P. 1928. Field studies in the behavior of the non-social wasps // Transactions of the Academy of Sciences of St. Luis, 25(9):325-489.

Rau, P. 1933. The jungle bees and wasps of Barro Colorado Island. Kirkwood, St. Louis, 324 p.

Tsuneki, K. 1970. Gleanings on the bionomics of the East-Asiatic non-social wasps (Hymenoptera). VI. Some species of Trypoxyloninae // Etizenia, 45:1-20.

 
Males of some species of the genus Palarus (Crabronidae, Palarini) have fixed mating territories, within which they not only search for females, but also drive out other males.

I will add that this behavior is also typical for male bumblebees. They also leave smell tags around the perimeter of their territory.

I will add that this behavior is also typical for male bumblebees. They also leave smell tags around the perimeter of their territory.

Odorous marks are left on the "perches" within "their" territory by males of very many burrowing wasps. So they are sometimes easier to catch. You sit next to the route and wait for it to make another circle.

So, it turns out that their functions are mainly protective, and that some, in particular, the Pison and Trypoxylon species, have monogamous relationships?

So, it turns out that their functions are mainly protective, and that some, in particular, the Pison and Trypoxylon species, have monogamous relationships?

Security cameras, no doubt. Moreover, in their origin, they are directly related to territorial ones, i.e., from the protection of "their" territory from other males.

As for family constancy, there is little data yet, and most of it is monogamy. At least for the period when the nest is full. But after that, the male can copulate with another female.

However, there is unconfirmed information that a male Trypoxylon politum can simultaneously "curate" several females. At least in those observations, it simultaneously guarded 2-3 nests located nearby (females of this species build long vertical galleries of clay divided into cells).

AVA, and you are not in cattle-males in all Hymenoptera are haploid or not? And then I doubted it, looking at the ability of males... Although in printsyp, these things can co-exist.

diploid males are already (usually) a genetic disorder, often occurring in inbreeding

When inbreeding? Diploids in this case are the result of fertilization or just the result of doubling the DNA in the egg? An interesting mechanism would be - after all, in hymenoptera (as I have read everywhere so far), haploid/diploid is the same basis for sex differences as in us XX/XY.

you're far wrong pereponovyh males have no U-chrosoma!Otherwise, you will think how they would be born parthenocarpically-this is scientifically proven!And this is due to a violation of sex differentiation, because all embryos do not have a sex until a certain period - they are bisexual!That is, males are not haploid as a rule, but diploid,then they should have been females, you see?

Of course not! And where did I write that there is? I was talking about the fact that the signal for sex determination is initially induced by the haploid or diploid number of chromosomes, just as in our case the initial induction comes from something on the Y chromosome... as it is, there is no connection... what about inbreeding?

Well yes rather it is a drone polyploid obtained by disrupting cell division in chromosomes