Reasons for the change in the number of swallowtails

Here's about Migia, its area is certainly larger, about 4 thousand hectares probably, but nevertheless,

Esox.. Have you ever heard of such a thing as crowding? Unfortunately, in some large gullies we have planted trees in the most interesting areas, and the most diverse, including oak forests, by the way, I live near one of these oak forests, and that's where I found a deer beetle.

And in this case, the steppe turns, the steppe turns, into an elegant black forest. And it is no longer a steppe. Therefore, to write about the fact that deer beetles and others are found in your steppe, to put it mildly, is bold. Got it, no? I'm telling you: you're calling all your landscapes a steppe, but not a city. When I listed the plants, I mentioned only those that grow exactly in the steppe (except for the Boucher's bird patch), and exactly within the city, and if I remembered all the plants of Donetsk, and even the region, I would add...

And in this case, the steppe turns, the steppe turns, into an elegant black forest. And it is no longer a steppe. Therefore, to write about the fact that deer beetles and others are found in your steppe, to put it mildly, is bold. Got it, no? I'm telling you: you're calling all your landscapes a steppe, but not a city. When I listed the plants, I mentioned only those that grow exactly in the steppe (except for the Boucher's bird patch), and exactly within the city, and if I remembered all the plants of Donetsk, and even the region, I would add...

Ezox, are you okay ? )))) What does the steppe have to do with beetles, deer and barbels, did you ask me - do we have these animals in the steppe, or do we have them at all? Well, we have them. And yes - woodland-it is also located in the steppe, it is not a forest
Esox, the forest is a primary, natural ecotope, if we had forests, they have long been gone. So yes, the deer beetle lives in the steppe zone, in artificially created stands of trees there. And yet, yes-almost all of our landscapes, including the city, are steppe, former or existing. Such are the cases, ixpert )))

Well, first of all, it all has to do with the Luhansk region more, we are arguing about the Donetsk region here

Well, for example, I took a piece of the Donetsk ridge - it is in both regions.

Well, first of all, the species diversity in the Luhansk region is high due to the mixing of different zones-forest, steppe, there are chalk, granite steppes, etc.
But also in the Mykolaiv, Odesa and Kherson regions, this is also the case

I agree, well, the natural area is steppe throughout the region and there are no granite steppes. In the Donetsk region, there may be large areas of sandy steppe and Starobilsk steppes, but there is something that is not in the Luhansk region-granite steppes, coastal biotopes.
In other areas, this is all there, too, but much less (except for the sandy steppes exception), plowed harder-and the relief on the ridge is more serious and therefore it is more difficult to plow there, and the variety at one point due to height differences is greater.

 
Here is a link to the number of Red Book plants by region. Do not forget that botanica in the east is studied many times better than in the south of Ukraine, so the number of plant species in our country is most likely underestimated.
http://redbook-ua.org/ru/plants/region

I can not judge how much better studied plants, but 90 Nikolaevskaya 147 Donetsk on this link.

Plants are studied throughout Ukraine much better than insects. It is understandable: if there is a plant in the biotope, then with a more or less thorough study it is impossible not to find it, plus there are much fewer species. So Roma simply drives about the poorly studied flora of Mykolaiv region, taking wishful thinking.

This post was edited by INO-08/15/2015 20: 34

 
I can not judge how much better studied plants, but 90 Nikolaevskaya 147 Donetsk on this link.

Well, based on the fact that half of the plants I found in our KK ravines were not marked, and the fact that there is a powerful botanical school in Donetsk/Luhansk, conclusions can be drawn

So where is the cryptocheilus snapshot from? This is interesting.

Due to plowing, Ezox claims that they have the entire Donetsk region plowed, but we do not have it because of bad land, although this is nonsense-we just have one of the maximum plowing, and in the Donetsk region there are many rocky areas...

For me personally, all wildlife is interesting, and jargon is evil)
And so yes, like cryptoheilus, red book, but where is it photographed, that's the question?)

For me, too, it is interesting, I think like everyone on the forum - but physically there is not enough time for everything. So I do one group, the rest-if you have time.
Photographed in the aforementioned Proval. Yes, not the Donetsk region, but I think it will be there too.

Roma, tuk-tuk, who is there, speaking of the total plowing of the steppes, I meant only the vicinity of the city of Donetsk, and not the entire region! But in fact, the area is also plowed be healthy, with the exception of only these small outcrops of rocks, which are now all nature reserves. And I believe that the real power is not these stunted petrophytic communities (even if they have a large proportion of rare and endemic species), but rather a flat steppe on fat chernozem (you don't have such a thing, so you don't understand). And now it is just plowed to 99.99%. It remains to be satisfied with the smallest pieces on the slopes of the beams. But they also show that the power is strong.

And when I visited Nikolaev, I noticed that there behind city blocks almost at once huge sites of not plowed lands begin. They were still full of hunters with guns. We do not have such a thing even close, people hunt (or rather hunted) only in these very narrow gullies, in dividing forest belts, or even just on arable land. You've been comparing landscapes from the height of your favorite Google satellite for a long time, haven't you?

This post was edited by INO-08/15/2015 20: 48

And Grnitno-steppe Pobuzhye - so really 900 against 800, but so the territory is 10 times larger. Plus a large river probably with azonal floodplain forests, I have a steppe. I can combine this with the Stanichno-Luganskoye department - there is also a floodplain there-it will be for 1000. Well, or Donetsk - there is Svyatogorsk National Park, also along the largest river of the region, there are a lot of forests - so 943 species. Yes - the area is even bigger, but it was created recently so it will still be added there.

It is more likely that the zapadentsians on the Donets will sooner or later reduce the forest (at least pine) to zero, as they have already done in large areas of their native Carpathians.

For me, too, it is interesting, I think like everyone on the forum - but physically there is not enough time for everything. So I do one group, the rest-if you have time.
Photographed in the aforementioned Proval. Yes, not the Donetsk region, but I think it will be there too.

In general, both major cryptoheiluses of ours are marked in the Crimea, one-one point in the Kherson region, but most likely they are everywhere in the southern part of the steppe, just no one has studied them. So if you define a species and have such ambitions, it will be a new find for the region.

As for the study of the flora, leading botanists personally told me this, and this is logical - according to the same CC, there are more than 100 species in the Odessa and Kherson regions, and we have only 90, although the ecotopes are the same, including part of Kinburn is included in the Nickname. area. So 130 types of QC are a minimum for us.
There will only be a dozen of my finds alone, and if you seriously investigate, then there will be another +30 40 types of QC..

It is more likely that the Zapadentsians on the Donets will sooner or later reduce the forest (at least pine) to zero, as they have already done in large areas of their native Carpathians.

The entire Donetsk region - 1,870 plant species. Do you have any data on Nikolaev?

So if you define a species and have such ambitions, it will be a new find for the region.
If you know any of the specialists in this group to reliably determine if this is possible from this photo-please.

This post was edited by Sergey-D-15.08.2015 21: 06

What are the staples? They are Westerners, we are Easterners, quite normal cultural terminology. At first I wanted to use a slightly different word, but I refrained, so as not to offend anyone inadvertently. Suddenly, some of the locals like that the Ukrainian troops are standing on the Donets cutting down the forest.

However, the fact that those forests are "made with a shovel" in no way justifies their total deforestation, contrary to all environmental standards, by Kiev-controlled organizations. By the way, if you don't like the steppe reforestation so much, then take the initiative to give all the forests of Mykolaiv region, and for one thing - and pine forests in Oleshkinsky sands for the needs of the national army. At the same time, it will also be a fight against the unholy Soviet legacy.

This post was edited by INO-08/15/2015 21: 08

The entire Donetsk region - 1,870 plant species. Do you have any data on Nikolaev?

So if you define a species and have such ambitions, it will be a new find for the region.
If you know any of the specialists in this group to reliably determine if this is possible from this photo-please.

That's exactly what the Nickname data is about. I didn't find the areas, and even the same nerds don't know them. There are scattered data on nature reserves - 700 thousand Chernomorsky, 900 Migia, 500 El. Surprisingly, the general flora - there is no such data, and they say that the data for nature reserves is rather incomplete.

I think that even from the photo - quite possibly from specialists - Carcharot can help, but it is unlikely that he will subscribe to the definition for publication only from the image

Suddenly, some of the locals like that the Ukrainian troops are standing on the Donets cutting down the forest.

Mdya..

Well, where you collect porcini mushrooms, there are also plantings. They should be brought together so that the natural biodiversity of the desert landscape is not hindered from developing and spreading in the Kherson, Mykolaiv and other regions. And as for the biodiversity of the Pridontsovskaya sandy steppe, you just didn't guess. There's still a lot of it left. That's a lot of bullshit, I'll tell you that. At least in comparison with the steppe on the chernozems.

Sergey-D: This is an interesting question, but did you catch moths on the trash with the help of light or not ? Just curious about what the change in altitude does for night hunting . In theory, it should bite better .

as for me, the trash is a bad place for fishing. Well, high, yes, but what's around? Locality, at best deposits? or other places that are obviously not very diverse. It will be visible for a dozen kilometers, but no one will fly in from such distances. Some do not fly out of their biotopes at all - even if you put them next to them. It is better to find a beam with a good view and fish in it. Well, that's my opinion.

Those who smoke, but need not " fly " if you can see so far?)))

I have caught more than 200 types of scoops from my balcony, including cucumbers, 4 catocals of different types, oak hawkmoth and all sorts of other rarities (but not saturnium..), I live outside the city, and a piece of small virgin land in 4 thousand hectares is nearby of course, but still ) Now I do not catch for a long time in the light, but here on the window piles of butterflies crawl, and this is the height of about 30 meters

That's exactly what the Nickname data is about. I didn't find the areas, and even the same nerds don't know them. There are scattered data on nature reserves - 700 thousand Chernomorsky, 900 Migia, 500 El. Surprisingly, the general flora - there is no such data, and they say that the data for nature reserves is rather incomplete.

I think that even from a photo - it is quite possible, from specialists - Carcharot can help, but it is unlikely that he will subscribe to the definition for publication only by a snapshot

In general, about this dispute - I judge by the fact that we have: wetter steppe; more difficult terrain; more different types of steppe in large areas. So let's leave until there is more complete data on your area.

Curious - under will not sign podzumyvaesh-not sure about the accuracy of the definition without collectible material or does not trust suddenly I went to the Crimea, for example)??

And in terms of animals, our regions predominate by a large margin over Donetsk and Luhansk.

http://redbook-ua.org/ru/animals/region

In general, about this dispute - I judge by the fact that we have: wetter steppe; more difficult terrain; more different types of steppe in large areas. So let's leave until there is more complete data on your area.

Well, and in the Nickname. the region also has many zones, in fact 4re large ones - the Pontic steppe, steppe, and forest-steppe, and almost 200 thousand hectares of desert.

Those who smoke, but need not " fly " if you can see so far?)))

I have caught more than 200 types of scoops from my balcony, including cucumbers, 4 catocals of different types, oak hawkmoth and all sorts of other rarities (but not saturnium..), I live outside the city, and a piece of small virgin land in 4 thousand hectares is nearby of course, but still ) Now I do not catch for a long time in the light, but here on the window piles of butterflies crawl, and this is a height of about 30 meters

Really more than 200? Then super, publish it.
I have a little less species at one point - but there are mostly dachas-vegetable gardens, then pine trees and a piece of oak forest.

That is, the point is that you can even be sure of the definition from the photo - well, there are simply no other options, for example, but still for a full-fledged publication in smart magazines, you need to refer to the instance

Really more than 200? Then super, publish it.
I have a little less species at one point - but there are mostly dachas-vegetable gardens, then pine trees and a piece of oak forest.

Ta, I do not suffer from such ambitions - all sorts of publications )) Yes, and for publication, you need a definition by specialists - otherwise I would not agree - that is, I have to send everything caught to someone, then the definition is in person and not by photos ,and then only by bagels

Ta, I do not suffer from such ambitions - all sorts of publications )) Yes, and for publication, you need a definition by specialists - otherwise I would not agree - that is, I have to send everything caught to someone, then the definition is in person and not based on photos ,and then only on bagels

And why immediately ambitions, just as a contribution to faunistics, what is the problem, I would pass on to specialists - if I had collected it for a long time, for example, in Kiev Klyuchko.

That is, the point is that you can even be sure of the definition from the photo - well, there are simply no other options, for example, but still for a full-fledged publication in smart magazines, you need to refer to the instance

That is, so that I can publish, for example: I had a cotton scoop as a mass type, and if I still have many dates - I will catch at least 100 today, 100 tomorrow and before the end of summer, I will do the same with winter, exclamation, clover, etc. - I will have copies like in the British Museum.
My opinion is to take what is difficult to determine/not at all determined by external signs, those types that can be confused. And for the rest, there are enough photos (photo material is also material) or even just diary entries.

That is, so that I can publish, for example: I had a cotton scoop as a mass type, and if I still have many dates - I will catch at least 100 today, 100 tomorrow and before the end of summer, I will do the same with winter, exclamation, clover, etc. - I will have copies like in the British Museum.
My opinion is to take what is difficult to determine/not at all determined by external signs, those types that can be confused. And for the rest, there are enough photos (photo material is also material) or even just diary entries.

So why catch all 100 pieces? ) One copy of the scoop is sufficient,
and in general, alas, but the fact is that copies are always needed for science, this is important and very important. Without instances, all this will then be questionable data.

And in terms of animals, our regions predominate by a large margin over Donetsk and Luhansk.

http://redbook-ua.org/ru/animals/region

Only one thing is really visible here: Crimea is a force. It's not for nothing that you wrote it down in your profile as a place of residence - you want to steal this power at least a little. And the difference between the Donetsk and Mykolaiv regions is in the area of statistical error. But in fact, comparing biodiversity by CC is still a perversion.

Romyn's problem is actually simple: for some reason (why exactly, the answer is obviously worth looking for in the field of psychological trauma), he considers all official specialists (except for a few selected ones, but they are not up to the scoops) to be fiends of the forces of evil and does not intend to help them in any way. That's how all the data and collections collected by it will disappear/have already disappeared.

This post was edited by ENO-08/15/2015 22: 37

By the way, since we're talking about paranoia, about the "theft of ideas"(tm)-about publications on photos, ambitions, and impurity in science.

Let's say you want a certain Esox ))) an impure N. S. or just an ambitious naturalist for the sake of a jackdaw in his CHSV to publish data on the location of Bolivia in the NIC. For example, he reads on the forum that a certain hierophis wrote that it is there, for example, and posted a photo,
takes this photo, comes up with a point from a fool and publishes a note.
Well, this is at least plagiarism, but it will be more or less true, but you can really find a photo on the Internet and publish it in general fiction )))

Still why a copy - you will need genetic islledovaniya, the same scoop, or cryptoheilusov - with photos of DNA can not be isolated)) Well, in general, to study morphology.. In general, instances are always needed if you do something "for the sake of science"..

 
Romyn's problem is actually simple: for some reason (why exactly, the answer is obviously worth looking for in the field of psychological trauma), he considers all official specialists (except for a few selected ones, but they are not up to the scoops) to be fiends of the forces of evil and does not intend to help them in any way. That's how all the data and collections collected by it will disappear/have already disappeared.

Ezox, I have already said a hundred times-who has what hurts) You are a typical bazaar woman-even though you are rushing to "specialists" For such things, a conversation in the appropriate educational institutions is generally supposed, especially according to Raseysky laws.

Without detracting from the fact that many of our NS are, to put it mildly, too arrogant and ambitious, most of them are just like people, the system itself is rotten
Here, for example, I see such a megaspecialsit as Ezox, with its "objective data"," species_name "in Donetsk is definitely not", such an expert who determines the height of sage from the pictures above ))) and what opinion should I have about individual ns?
But again, about individual, not "all".

In a dry copy, the DNA is poorly preserved. It is necessary in alcohol, and immediately.

In a dry copy, the DNA is poorly preserved. It is necessary in alcohol, and immediately.

Well, an expert knows better, especially an expert in the field of modern Western technologies for DNA extraction, I keep my mouth shut here,
but the bottom line is that in the photo the DNA is not preserved at all by the campaign )))

So these very "Western technologists" advise categorically - in alcohol and stronger. But in fact, all this Western molecular biology for some reason, in most cases, as a result of analysis, builds phylogenetic trees that are strictly forbidden to look at without corvalol. So these DNA rays are still used to determine the species only when there are no alternative methods at all. That is, in 99.9% of cases, they do without them.

So these very "Western technologists" advise categorically - in alcohol and stronger. But in fact, all this Western molecular biology for some reason, in most cases, as a result of analysis, builds phylogenetic trees that are strictly forbidden to look at without corvalol. So these DNA rays are still used to determine the species only when there are no alternative methods at all. That is, in 99.9% of cases, they do without them.

Well, at one time, when the microscope was a curiosity or it did not exist at all, and anatomical and micromorphological features were new in the selection of species, then Linnean taxonomists probably also grimaced from the data on new methods.
There are a lot of questions about the methods of DNA analysis, but I think it will take another 10 years, and if the Pu does not start a nuclear war, I think that the DNA taxonomy will complement the different morphology by 99%)

Moreover, this is logical because almost all morphological features of the body are reflected in the DNA, well, + epigenetic moments, but these are nuances.

The problem is that it is almost impossible to identify the relationship between such genes and such a sign of an insect today. So what you're talking about is a matter for tomorrow. And you need to define the types today. Or your collection is a legacy for posterity. Hidden from the eyes of modern careless Ukrainian and Russian scientists, "produced in the scoop", for future righteous European luminaries of science? Isn't this by any chance the collection you accidentally tore up a few years ago?"

This post was edited by INO-08/15/2015 23: 29

And again misinformation)) When one of the boxes fell, they were irrevocably damaged ) ok 30 scoops, and that's it, it's certainly bad, but not fatal.

Well, yes, the collection is hidden from the eyes of such as Esox and left for Ukrainian scientists, when Ukraine joins the EU and science rises from the oppression of the past, that's when I will pass ))

Well, then the genes of humans, and even drosophila and some other model objects. The cost of decoding them and funding them is different, and the scope of work performed is different. If, of course, you give me a link to an article that says, for example, which combination of genes is responsible for the black last sternite of the polistov abdomen, and which is yellow, I admit my mistake.