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Arrangements for working with the material

Community and Forum → Entomological collections → Arrangements for working with the material

Konstantin Shorenko, 07.11.2008 22:50

Dear colleagues! I bring to your attention a new topic, which briefly boils down to the following. All of us sometimes work with other people's material, whether it's the collections of private collectors or reputable institutions. It is noteworthy that each curator (collector) puts forward their own requirements for the person processing the material, and often these requirements are purely verbal in nature. Question: is it advisable to draw up a "paper" contract containing the main parameters of interaction with signatures of both parties?

This post was edited by Dormidont - 07.11.2008 22: 51

Comments

08.11.2008 0:23, Bad Den

Yes, it is advisable. For "you can't put words to work."

08.11.2008 14:43, omar

Yes, I think it all depends on the individual. Who can be trusted can be trusted. After all, Russian merchants used to agree verbally, often without even knowing how to read and write. And the deceiver knew that after an impure case, the business would be closed for him.
Likes: 3

08.11.2008 15:28, barko

Yes, I think it all depends on the individual. Who can be trusted can be trusted. After all, Russian merchants used to agree verbally, often without even knowing how to read and write. And the deceiver knew that after an impure case, the business would be closed for him.

No, omar, this is not a question of trust, it's just that Dormidont wants to protect itself from possible unexpected claims from customers with such a document. Or did I misunderstand?
Likes: 1

08.11.2008 17:38, Konstantin Shorenko

Yes, everything is absolutely correct. Firstly, these are unexpected claims about the return of material (we agreed on one thing, and then-excuse me, I had to return it tomorrow), and secondly, these are things related to the belonging of the holotype-paratypes or rare species. In others, this is the right to publish the results of the study. For example, I came across such a scheme-1. Come help me determine what they say 2. let's conclude a contract I say. 3. They answer me in surprise - but don't you trust me, I gave the material to this, this and this and without any agreement. And what can I say? I think it's safer with paper. Then the question is-does anyone have any experience in drawing up such a contract?

08.11.2008 17:55, Nikolaj Pichugin

Yes, I think it all depends on the individual. Who can be trusted can be trusted. After all, Russian merchants used to agree verbally, often without even knowing how to read and write. And the deceiver knew that after an impure case, the business would be closed for him.

I completely agree with Omar, if you respect and trust a person , why do you need any written agreements? You can discuss everything in words.
And you don't trust ...!?! confused.gif
Although..., the contract is written in any form (as a receipt), a list of agreed terms is drawn up, and the contracting parties sign it.
Such a document is valid even in court. umnik.gif
Likes: 2

08.11.2008 21:15, Victor Titov

Everything is right. If there is a need for such a contract, then it assumes a simple written form. For those who are particularly worried, you can also notarize it. However, I personally fully agree with the opinion of omar, and Nikolai Pichugin.

08.11.2008 22:33, Konstantin Shorenko

Gentlemen, How do you know what a person is like, since you haven't worked with them before and have no idea about their "hidden" abilities? Often this is exactly what they put pressure on - do you respect me? Then let's put it in words. And if there is a conflict? If they tell you later-thank you dear for the definition, all the best. What then. How to prove that you are not a ram and the contract was exactly like that, and not any other. We agreed on the number of your shares in the material, and then you will apologize, but this is all ours. And what are you protected by, words? I'm just wondering, has anyone worked like this under a contract or just in words?

08.11.2008 23:30, Victor Titov

The contract itself cannot be a guarantee against the partner's dishonesty. If you are deceived, the contract will only serve as proof of your rightness when applying to the court. However, I am not personally aware of any cases of such lawsuits being considered by the courts.

08.11.2008 23:45, omar

To be honest, I can hardly imagine the form of this agreement. This is most likely a banal receipt. Type: January 5 received 5 swallowtails in perfect condition with labels: - - - - -. I undertake to return them on January 25, all in the same safety. It can be notarized. And everything to do. Or am I wrong, Dmitrich?
Likes: 1

08.11.2008 23:58, Victor Titov

I think we are talking about some other arrangements. For example, a specialist undertakes to process the partner's material (identify, straighten, etc.), and in return expects to receive a certain share of this material. This is already a service agreement. Either the partners agree on the use of the results of processing the material (publication - who is the first, roughly speaking-authorship, etc., etc.). Copyright may already be affected here...

This post was edited by Dmitrich - 08.11.2008 23: 59
Likes: 1

09.11.2008 0:46, Konstantin Shorenko

Exactly so!!! Here is an example of such a proposed contract. I did it today.
Likes: 1

09.11.2008 1:01, Victor Titov

Well, in general, as they used to say at party meetings before, the project can be taken as a basis. But, to be honest, the document is certainly a bit raw. I won't say too much, but I would like to point out that it is advisable to refer to the contract in accordance with the types of transactions provided for in the Civil Code (since this is certainly a civil contract; the name "cooperation agreement" does not fully reflect the specific meaning of the agreements). In addition, since this is a civil law relationship, all disputes should definitely be resolved not in accordance with clause 4.1 of the agreement ("on a mutually respectful basis"), but solely on the basis of current legislation. The court (if the case comes to it) will be guided only and only by the law, if the provisions of the contract contradict it.
Likes: 1

09.11.2008 1:10, Konstantin Shorenko

I do not pretend to infallibility smile.gifFor this I opened the topic to understand this is generally the right thing or not to bother with it and work "the old-fashioned way"

09.11.2008 9:43, amara

Likes: 1

20.12.2008 12:58, Дзанат

At the Pet Museum, I wrote a receipt, or rather filled out a form. Very simple: last name, address, phone number, how many and which beetles were taken (listed) from the entomology department up to (number), who issued them (curator's last name). Copy to me.
But I didn't take any standard copies.
In another case, the same museum did not write any receipts, Omar is right.

20.12.2008 16:29, Zlopastnyi Brandashmyg

Receipts are also useful as a "cure for sclerosis". How many copies did I take from you?
And in general, receipts are useful.

20.12.2008 16:30, KDG

and what exactly are the problems? When you take the material in the institution, the loan list available in each office is filled out. There and the number and terms and conditions are specified..

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