Pierce through beetles in collections?

Bad Den
Sorry to be so blunt, but you'd have to be a complete idiot to keep soaked material in a desiccator all day!!! After soaking, the beetles are easier to freeze in the refrigerator, and if necessary, get them from there in small batches for further work. In this case, time does not limit your work, beetles are always available at any time!
Identifying beetles is easier to do before mounting, when they are movable, i.e. soaked, and you can twist them as you like to determine the signs. Pinning or sticking on the die is already secondary. Here I fully agree-fixed signs are easier to calculate. Especially if we are talking about describing a new view, and you are working with series.

Dmitrich:
I used small beetles as an example to show that if you can handle small ones like this, then it's not a problem with large ones at all - you can't miss
the same thing about sticking them completely on the die - you shouldn't talk about it. Some prefer it, but these are usually purely aesthetic collections with no pretensions to science. Or copies. these collections define in advance

Den, use thymol in the desiccator.Or at the very least-fill it with vodka .

I glue all the beetles in this way
Triangle of film (gadget) +colorless nail polish
To peel off, drop ethyl acetate on a toothpick for 2-3 seconds. and the bug is unstuck.

  
Alex, get the nutcracker wet!And then prick it, since your entire collection is pricked

Reluctance. It's very nicely pasted.
But Kolot's collection isn't complete. Small things, of course, are pasted on. Ants are glued to almost everything. But Zhukov 10-15 mm, sinful, Kolya.

This post was edited by alex 2611-05.12.2010 00: 14

Of course, you can shout about practicality and stab beetles by the thousands, or you can talk about aesthetics and straighten each beetle!

And who here from the supporters of the tattoo has ever said that a bug impaled on a pin should not be straightened?!

Yes, what can I say-go to the topic "collections" and see pricked beetles and spot beetles.Bugs at forumchan in the majority the same and it is possible to compare.
In general, I will say this-the die is aesthetically pleasing, the tattoo is practical.Choose one.But for me, the stab beetle is already losing its quality

Well, if you're so drunk, cut the last cucumber . This is to the question of the advantage of a sticker on dies in comparison with a tattoo from the point of view of aesthetics. Here, follow this link: http://molbiol.ru/forums/index.php?showtopic=146156 and, having looked at the specimens from the collection of the respected Entalex, just try, without deceiving your soul, to continue to say that the impaled beetle is unsightly?! Most of the beetles presented on this page are impaled, and how beautifully they are spread out, how they look! It's not the mounting method that matters, but the skill and accuracy of the installer!

This post was edited by Dmitrich - 05.12.2010 05: 30

An impaled beetle is not not aesthetically pleasing, but it is less aesthetically pleasing, and some even collapse when a great beetle, a great view, a great spread and on a pin ) But this is my godfather.
Still, it is absolutely a whole beetle that gives you more pleasure )

Well, as they say, everyone has their own taste: one likes watermelon, the other pork gristle...

Here, follow this link: http://molbiol.ru/forums/index.php?showtopic=146156

When you look at an impaled beetle, you immediately pay attention to the ball that is on the needle and that covers the hole of the beetle, thereby preventing you from calmly viewing the beetle.That is, you have to focus not on the image of the beetle itself,but on not paying attention to this needle!

This post was edited by Liparus-05.12.2010 11: 20

Den, use thymol in the desiccator.Or at the very least-fill it with vodka .

Thymol at home - refuse, because it is a carcinogen. Vodka-yes, an option.
I now add "Mr. Muscle" to the desiccator, the effect is wonderful, even if the material was in the mold, cleans it without a trace.

That is, you have to focus not on the image of the beetle itself,but on not paying attention to this needle!

You need to work harder on yourself !!!

This post was edited by Bad Den-05.12.2010 12: 21

You need to work harder on yourself !!!  

Or fix your eyesight ...

I completely disagree with this position. Many experts will not attempt to identify unmounted material at all. And insects are undoubtedly more convenient to identify after the correct mount for each group. When you know how to mount a particular insect, who needs to straighten the legs, who needs to leave the underside open for viewing, who needs to prepare the genitals, then you don't have to peel or soak the insect later.

Many specialists will not have to peel off or soak the insect later, if they work with the beetle before the tire iron!

Pancake... When will this topic die down?!
Kolschiki, kleyschiki - what the fuck difference does it make?
The integrity of the material and the possibility of redefinition without "hemorrhoids"is important.
Much worse is the lack of paws, antennae, or anything else.
You don't have to prove anything to anyone.
Because if you stick it more aesthetically pleasing (or "glamorous", or "fashionable") - it absolutely does not mean that the crushed material is an anachronism. Give a specialist a material with the lower diagnostic signs taped up and a stab to determine - and feel the difference.
I myself glue relatively large beetles to a small lining (well, like the one shown by Ripper). However, I will never give up the desired, but crushed material.
And I don't give a shit about the hole, I don't decorate walls with it. Here from the point of view of commercial sales, yes, punctured material (beetles) cost 2 times less.

What to do if you don't have this type in your reference books?
What, then let him lie down and rot or feed the kozheeds until the literature is found. Although there is no need to start with all the literature on this family to buy, read. And only then do the collection of material, so that they are then not peeled off and not removed from the pin, to determine.

Or improve your eyesight ...

Today, my eyesight is the envy of many entomologists.

You need to work harder on yourself !!!  

Your comments - one is scarier than the other.

You don't have to prove anything to anyone.
Because if you stick it more aesthetically pleasing (or "glamorous", or "fashionable") - it absolutely does not mean that the crushed material is an anachronism. Give a specialist a material with the lower diagnostic signs taped up and a stab to determine - and feel the difference.

+5!!!

I myself glue relatively large beetles to a small lining (well, like the one shown by Ripper). However, I will never give up the desired, but crushed material.
And I don't give a shit about the hole, I don't decorate walls with it. But from the point of view of commercial sales, yes, punctured material (beetles) cost 2 times less.

Quod erat demonstrandum!!!

Kolschiki, kleyschiki - what the fuck difference does it make?

I totally agree!!! A request to all - let's not step on the rake again, and unsuccessfully try to convert each other to their faith? Guys, let's live together!

The topic won't stall so easily. We've been discussing the same thing for a long time, on previous pages. We argue not because something is more important, but because we like to argue, look for arguments, refute. Or that just me?

Absolutely Agree!!!

The topic won't stall so easily. We've been discussing the same thing for a long time, on previous pages. We argue not because something is more important, but because we like to argue, look for arguments, refute. Or that just me?

The process is sometimes more important than the result, and not only in entomology...

Your comments - one is scarier than the other.

I'm like joking

Many specialists will not have to peel off or soak the insect later, if they work with the beetle before the tire iron!

Yes, damn, the problem is that beetles are not always correctly identified the first time.
I also really want to compare already defined beetles with new material.

I'm a little late to join in the discussion, but I'll still give you my professional opinion. Glue or prick - it does not matter, it is important what goal you are pursuing. If you are going to take the collection with you to the grave-do as you see fit. But I have come across many cases when amateur collectors at the end of their lives or simply "burned out" wanted to give the collection to a scientific institution. And that's where the problems start. Improperly mounted insects are very difficult to work with, and if you have long-term plans to transfer your collection, then you need to make it easier to work with it. You can not glue on artificial polymers - they are prone to self-decay. Glue only on thin cardboard, preferably "acid free paper". In my work, I have seen old dies made of fine mica. They look decent, but in my opinion the sheepskin is not worth the trouble. It is desirable to glue with water-soluble adhesives: "Hercules", CMC (carboxymethyl cellulose), you can also use gum. PVA cannot be used: it contains acid that destroys chitin over time, and the glue itself loses its ability to dissolve over time. In my opinion, most beetles and bedbugs with a size of 20 mm or more should be pricked. The weight of large insects will eventually skew the die and it will start to hang out. Yes, and you need to be able to glue. Some must be glued to the side or like the Americans to the side. Many key features, such as in Histeridae and Coccinellidae, are located on the underside of the body, and if you stick them as usual, you will get beautiful beetles without information. Well, the advice to keep "collections" glued to boxes, under cellophane or pricked with hidden needles-this is not for a serious collection. If you have any questions , I'll share my experience.

Maybe there is a more or less official point of view that defines the standard? Not all sorts of practices, but something at the level of the code. Then there will be no questions - either according to the code, or not...

There are no codes. There are only recommendations and common sense.

Codes are nonsense. Well, I mean in this regard. There are generally accepted things - do not stab in the back, do not stab in the shield, etc. Everything else is a matter of taste and tp

That's really on the topic of codes-I constantly struggle with the tattooing of cockroaches, earwigs, praying mantises, pryamoptera, and so on. orthopteroids through the right elytra, which, by the way, is recommended in the vast majority of manuals. Such a tattoo is an UNAMBIGUOUS DAMAGE to the MATERIAL, because in the process of work it is very often necessary to unfold the wings.

Zlopastnyi Brandashmyg and then where to prick them?

In the right part of the pronotum. And every little thing I have long collected only in alcohol. It's not aesthetically pleasing, but it's convenient to work with.

Prick on the classics!!!!Nature itself made the first collections in resin (amber).Many pros and cons.But the safety is max.Classics developed needles...And do not violate the customs of the ancestors of the Bulls ...(as in the old joke).Recently legalized and gay and Lesbian and other glamor!Here's the result-the collection should look glamorous!And for me, the classics go ahead!!!How nice to look at beautifully impaled beetles and spread out in the same style, in the same handwriting!It's time to argue and nafiga need labels definitional and geographical not glamurninko!Let the corpses look more lively,and you need to spray them with toilet spray-the beetles stink painfully!....I look at Wernicke's selling butterflies, beetles, and so on-no needles or labels are lovely!I ask all glamorous comers to go there-you shouldn't hang out here.Definitely prick!!!Less than 10 mm per die!And then all the Hercules will turn into dies-parashki-drum-mu....

In the right part of the pronotum. And every little thing I have long collected only in alcohol. It's not aesthetically pleasing, but it's convenient to work with.

Then it's better to go to the right side of the shield. Pronotum... perebor

That's how you need to prick???

That's how you need to prick???

Ilya, yes, it is better to" put it on the block " (my opinion)

How good that I do not catch them, do not use them, do not prick them, do not glue them, but only photograph them
True, this summer I will catch, but in order to remove the lower part, and then I will let go-let them live on
But photographing impaled beetles (from collections) is very difficult - sometimes the pin in the photo takes up a lot of space. If the beetle is large, then the pin is easily zashopit, and on small beetles this leads to image distortion

This post was edited by gumenuk - 30.01.2011 13: 29

That's how you need to prick???

Yes, that's what I'm doing, moving a little away from the midline.

Then it's better to go to the right side of the shield. Pronotum... enumeration

Isn't that the same thing? To be more precise, I prick the right side of the pronotum.

Ilya, yes, it is better to" put it on the block " (my opinion)

Some time ago, I glued earwigs, especially small ones, under the abdomen, since the structure of breast sternites is of systematic importance. Now I store it in alcohol.

what is the dispute about??? is it the dispute itself or the process? each group (and often genus) of beetles or TD has its own diagnostic features and is mounted in its own way. a "special" will determine both the filled and chopped and a piece of medium XXXX I think the question is what do you want to do with it later: trade, for yourself in a box, genetics.....? when you decide on this question,the first one disappears

Well, we talked about beetles here, so the sticker and tattoo are a long-standing dispute (many have already switched from one side to the other and back). Once pricked, then once looked at the collection of Frantic'a in the pasted state and just struck by the aesthetic side, went to the sticker. I thought-why can't I pay as much attention to my dear and beloved collection, try to make it perfect