Arctiidae-dippers

And where in Ukraine do Eilema pseudocomplanum, Eilema caniolum live (in addition to the Crimea)? How far north are Eilema palliatellum and E. pygmaeolum known? Are there any finds of Setina roscida other than the north? I will be very grateful for your answer!

This post was edited by vvdubatolov - 13.12.2010 13: 00

Why deplanum and not depressum?

Over the years, I didn't understand lichens myself. I made a mistake with the year of depressa - it should be 1787; described a page later and Figure 3, not 1-2 on the same table. In de Freina & Witt, 1987 - " Eilema deplana (Esper, 1787) "[wrote a combination of them].

I found an error - Eilema kansuense turned out to be an independent species, and not a subspecies of E. lurideolum! The biggest difference in genitals!

Eilema palliatellum - Kiev region,Bukrin, 2009 (I can specify the date) call. R. Gerasimov (caught together, but flew one copy to him), for the rest I can not add anything.

My instance - you may need some useful information
Atolmis rubricollis (Linnaeus, 1758) - 12.06.2010; Ukraine; Kiev region; Obukhov district; village. Kozin; Recreation center "Mezhdurechye-3" (50°13'19"N; 30°41' 45 " E); field with access to the river bank.Kozinka; on light 250 W DRL + 125 W UFDRL

My instance - you may need some useful information
Atolmis rubricollis (Linnaeus, 1758) - 12.06.2010; Ukraine; Kiev region; Obukhov district; village. Kozin; Recreation center "Mezhdurechye-3" (50°13'19"N; 30°41' 45 " E); field with access to the river bank.Kozinka; on light 250 W DRL + 125 W UFDRL

In general, griseolum, complanum, deplanum, lutarellum, sororculum, lurideolum, rubricollis, quadra, miniata-common, some even mass, I would say, for our region( including yours, for example, during the summer in Bukrin),

This post was edited by svm2 - 12/13/2010 15: 25

For svm2:
Please, if you can, give us a photo of Eilema palliatellum from Bukryn! A huge request to take a picture from BELOW!

This post was edited by vvdubatolov - 12/14/2010 17: 04

I asked the owner for a copy and promised to take a picture for the weekend.

Here is his photo with the answer

Hello Vasily!

The butterfly flew quite a bit. What would she give him?

According to literature data, it is known from the following regions::

Kiev, Poltava, Dnepropetrovsk, as well as

Galicia, Bessarabia, Podillia, Donets Basin not counting,

Of course, the Crimea.

All the best, sincerely, Slava.

Are there any finds of Setina roscida other than the north?

In the Donetsk region it was caught by

V. V. Dubatolov and forumchanam...

Many thanks for the information about Sphinx thin pins. Where can I get passable ones? It is necessary to prick the micro on the Lower Amur. I would like to get to the field.
- this company from the latest purchases bend not only 000 and 00 - BUT also 0 !???

I know most of the materials on the Penza Region from Shlykov's article in Entomological Review and his own collections submitted to the ZIN.
- have they redefined Shlykov lichens????? There are a lot of mistakes in his definition - I never found out which of the lepidopteran specialists he communicated with (and he definitely did not cook sexual devices...). I saw his collection in the 90s five times, it was simply eaten by kozheaters in front of my eyes... Well, at least the remnants got into the ZIN and there were great rarities (such as Pinker's scoops) when redefining!

It seems to me extremely unlikely that Somatrichia parasita (I already wrote - not Ocnogyna!) will be found in the Penza region, which is too northern for this species.
- I asked Alexey Matov to find this Shlykovsky specimen in the ZIN funds, but alas, he did not find the butterfly(ec)... It's probably hard to confuse it with other species??

The old most northern directions (Samara province on the banks of the Volga) and Saratov have not yet been confirmed by specific collections, especially since the borders of the provinces were then completely different from what the regions are now. The only reliable point for today in the south-east of European Russia is Kamyshin in the Volgograd region, Melnikova village. Previously, it was the territory of the Saratov province, and labels from Saratov could refer to it. I do not know any more indications of the presence of Somatrichia parasita in Russia...
- VERY interesting information! I thought that this is a fairly "normal" view in the south of the Volga region!?? It comes out so early in the steppes to the light and do not catch!? Forumchane what do you say??

Are there any new finds of bears in the Penza region compared to Shlykov's collections?
- Yes, there is. Shlykov was a collector in "captivity" - he was diagnosed with a "bad heart" and often went for a walk in nature... here he is from idleness and became interested in collecting butterflies. He caught in 3-4 points. For example, he collected 105 conditional species for bulavousyms (he incorrectly identified several species), and we have already found 151. Of the higher ursins, I also found matronula and hera (+ an old red-dot find from the edges.the museum). What about the correct definition of lichens???


This post was edited by Penzyak - 12/15/2010 11: 53

V. V. Dubatolov and forumchanam...

Many thanks for the information about Sphinx thin pins. Where can I get passable ones? It is necessary to prick the micro on the Lower Amur. I would like to get to the field.
- this company from the latest purchases bend not only 000 and 00 - BUT also 0 !???

Which ones are black or stainless steel?

For smv2 and Vasily:

THE BIGGEST (!!!) thank you for the photos! Just what I could only have imagined happened. It does not appear to be Eilema palliatellum at all, as it has NO blackening along the costa from below the hindwings! Only Eilema pseudocomplanum has such light hind wings from below and this species has not yet been known in Ukraine outside the Crimea! But for an accurate definition, you need to look at the genitals. Can you help me? I will update the lichen website in the next few days - there will be photos.

This post was edited by vvdubatolov - 12/15/2010 17: 23

For Penzyk:

Thank you so much for your reply! I only worked with real bears in Zina. But even among them there was no Somatriphia parasita from the Penza region. That is why I wrote that from Russia this species is reliably known to me only from Kamyshin. I redefined Spilosoma lubricipedum / urticae - everything was mixed up there, but there were both types. Penza lichens have not been redefined. But it seems that most definitions of lichens need to be revised again. An illustrative example is the photo of Eilema "palliatellum" from the Kiev region. Many need to be digested. I've already found quite a few mistakes of my own. And what about the others! Please refer to my website, which I informed you about, for lichens. I'll update it soon, and I'll update it at least once a week.

Shlykov's collection was not in the general collection, I split it into bears myself.

Many thanks for the latest news in the Penza region. It's a pity they weren't included in the Catalog...

For smv2 and Vasily:

I am Vasily, and the owner is an ex. Slava (Rostislav), I just copied his email and pasted it into the post.
Regarding your request,I will talk to him, and maybe next year we will catch it , we often catch it there, we will be more attentive.

Dear Vasily and Rostislav,

Thank you so much for the photo. I absolutely did not expect Eilema pseudocomplanum to occur so far north in Ukraine, although it is known from Hungary. If you take a photo of both genitals, and the view is confirmed, you should definitely publish this find! Very happy for you!

Dear forumchane!

I just updated the lichen website <http://fen.nsu.ru/~vvdubat/Lithosiinae/Lithosiinaelist.html>. Now there are a lot of photos of genitalia and more specific information on how to distinguish some species, including the E. complanum-palliatellum-pseudocomplanum group. Additions and changes in the near future, of course, will be!

V. V. Dubatolov and forumchanam...

And what about Shlykov's find (1988) Lasydes spectabilis Tauch. - August 29, 1979 !?? Was this butterfly in the material you analyzed? Biology - ecology of the species??
I haven't been able to find it in our time...

Yes, I completely forgot from the new found more-see CC of the Penza region (Animals, 2005):
SPOTTED
BEAR Chelis maculosa (Gerring, 1780)
Order Lepidoptera
Family Dipper-Arctiidae
Category and status. 2 – a species that is declining in population.
Description. The length of the forewing is 14-16 mm. The forewings are light brown, with black, mostly wedge-shaped spots arranged in the form of 4-5 bandages. The hindwings are pink, with 3-4 bandages in the form of rounded spots, of which the three largest are located at the outer edge. The wing fringe is brown. The body is brownish-yellow, with a black longitudinal stripe, entirely covered with long, thick hairs. On the abdomen (from the sides) reddish spots. Antennae are comb-like (wider in males). The proboscis is reduced, as a result of which the butterflies do not feed. The region is inhabited by the subspecies C. m. honesta (Tauscher, 1806) [1], which differs from the nominative species by a well-defined marginal row of spots on the forewings [2].
Distribution. South of the European part of Russia, Southern Urals, South-western Siberia [3]. On the territory of the region, it is known to inhabit Tamalinsky [4], Kamensky and Kameshkir districts, on the northern border of its range [5].
Habitats and features of biology. Meadow steppe, steepened slopes of the southern exposure and bright, well-warmed edges of deciduous forests (with a predominance of mixed grasses). It develops in two generations, the butterfly years from late May to mid-June and from mid-July to early August [5]. Insects are active at dusk and the first third of the night, the flight is rapid along a wave-like trajectory. The caterpillars feed on true bedstraw (Galium verum L.) and other herbaceous plants [6]. The caterpillar overwinters. Pupation occurs in a light cocoon under rocks and in grass litter.
Population and limiting factors. A very rare and local species. Plowing of most of the meadow steppe resulted in localization of the species only in well-preserved areas of the meadow steppe on steep hillsides. A number of negative factors are obvious: spring burning of dry grass, intensive grazing and haymaking [5, 7].
Security measures. In the habitats of the species, a complete ban on spring burning of dry grass and complete mowing of grass stands should be introduced [7].
Information sources: 1. L. V. Bolshakov, personal communication; 2. Efetov and Budashkin, 1990; 3. Dubatolov, 1996; 4. Yu. N. Starikov, personal communication; 5. Polumordvinov and Monakhov, 2002; 6. Koch, 1991; 7.Polumordvinov, 2005.
Compiled by O. A. Polumordvinov and V. M. Velikoivanenko.

And what now false motley birds need to be considered in the same pubdication together with the bears!??

Denu-pins are black.

P.S. Yes, I forgot that I also found C. senex and O. guadra from lichens. And others need to be defined...

This post was edited by Penzyak - 12/16/2010 11:31 am

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On the territory of the region, it is known to inhabit Tamalinsky [4], Kamensky and Kameshkir districts, on the northern border of its range [5].

Can I use dots? Or a scan of this article [5]?

And what now false motley birds need to be considered in the same pubdication together with the bears!??

Now both lichens, false pox, and dippers are subfamily Arctiinae of the family Erebidae, see appendix.



 zahiri_et_al_2010.pdf

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Dear forumchane, and do not you think that the conclusion of the article Zahiri and company, based on the same facts, could be different-the scoop should be divided into a bunch of small families... Any scientific fact can be interpreted in different ways: birds can also be considered dinosaurs... But I don't feel like it. Molfilogeniya "sees" the order of divergence well, but how to estimate the SPEED and DEGREE of changes?
It is also possible to put scoops and sicklewings in the same family, despite the strong differences in genitalia.

So I am not yet ready to consider bears only as a subfamily of scoops. I can only agree that ALL the groups with anal glands in females: false mottles, African tyretids, euchromids, ctenuchids, lichens and dippers [by the way, the group is very well defined] can be driven into one family, but no more. It is better to divide the scoop into many different families. The moles were shared, and everyone got used to it. Otherwise, if the dipper-like animals are considered only a subfamily, and the former families are considered tribes, then they will turn out to be too gigantic groups, the division of which will be difficult to study. It is much easier and clearer to deal with smaller groups: monophilia is obvious, but for large groups it is not obvious.

Dear forumchane, and do not you think that the conclusion of the article Zahiri and company, based on the same facts, could be different-the scoop should be divided into a bunch of small families...

Well, of course you can - but why?

It is also possible to put scoops and sicklewings in the same family, despite the strong differences in genitalia.

In fact, this is done all over the world - except for Russia, which you can ignore.

The moles were shared, and everyone got used to it.

Well, you compared! With the moths, it was completely artificial stalling, at the level of Micro/Macrolepidoptera. And after the superfamilies are more or less settled - in complex groups - like, say, Gelechioidea-the boundaries and scope of families are still being revised.

It is much easier and clearer to deal with smaller groups: monophilia is obvious, but for large groups it is not obvious.

In this particular case, the boundaries of large groups are very well defined...

Please do not forget that the main task of taxonomy is convenience. In general, the entire taxonomy of this species is subjective. And, if we look at long-term trends, it develops in the direction of splitting up and reducing the number of lower taxa in the higher one. Who cares to consider Macrolepidoptera as one family (well, or three), but this point of view is logical - after all, the group (or its three constituent groups) is monophyletic! It only seems to me that after a long study of the relative arrangement of groups in Noctuoidea, sooner or later a decision will be made to split it into smaller families. IT is INCONVENIENT to work with large taxa! Remember how many supergiant genera were divided into smaller ones sooner or later? Even if we strictly adhere to the principle of monophyly of all taxa, it is always possible to draw a boundary between taxa "above" or "below", and then the volume of groups will be different, but the system will remain natural!

Another option: all bear-like animals (those who have anal glands in females) are a subfamily, so the former family of bears is one tribe! Then let's consider ALL bears in the narrow sense as one genus, or leave only the following genera: Callimorpha, Arctia, Diacrisia and Spilosoma! This follows quite logically from the first proposition...

This post was edited by vvdubatolov - 12/16/2010 17: 55

By the way, returning to Chelis maculosa-Murzin, don't mention it at night, cites it for the Ryazan region in his album - but it is not clear on what basis and where the material is.

For the Ryazan region (Blinushov and Co.) - C. maculosa is unknown. This species has not been found north of Penza for all the time of our search, although there are quite enough meadow steppes and good preservation (from bulavousyh, for example, there are found pigeons vikrama and bellargus-which are no longer in the south...).

Here is a map of points for C. maculosa from the Red Book of the Penza Region, Volume 2 (Animals, 2005) - Penza, "Penzenskaya Pravda", p. 41.
In this edition, we considered it necessary to include 4 species of bears: C. macululosa, E. luctifera (yes, this is also a new species for software !), P. matronula and A. festiva.

Pictures:

_________________________.jpg — (170.58к)

For the Ryazan region (Blinushov and Co.) - C. maculosa is unknown. This species has not been found north of Penza for all the time of our search, although there are quite enough meadow steppes and good preservation (from bulavousyh, for example, there are found pigeons vikrama and bellargus-which are no longer in the south...).

Here is a map of points for C. maculosa from the Red Book of the Penza Region, Volume 2 (Animals, 2005) - Penza, "Penzenskaya Pravda", p. 41.
In this edition, we considered it necessary to include 4 species of bears: C. macululosa, E. luctifera (yes, this is also a new species for software !), P. matronula and A. festiva.

If Blinushov did not bring her, it simply means that she was not in his training camp. But where Murzin got it from there - it would be interesting!

Unfortunately, you can't get points from the map to add them to the database...

That's why I'm writing an article on dipper PO-points, dates, biology and ecology of species in the study area.

It is clear that the false motley birds in the article about the bears that "goat-accordion" ... BUT, still, what to do ???

For Penzyak:

Please note that the name luctifera was introduced by Denis and Schiffermuller WITHOUT a DESCRIPTION (I personally watched the work), so it is a nomen nudum; such names are not considered valid. So far, there has been no decision of the International Nomenclature Commission that ALL names given in the work of Denis and Schiffermuller should be recognized as valid. There was only one decision, but it refers exclusively to the mutual priority of works published in 1775 (I watched it myself together with I. M. Kerzhner). The first reviewer of these names was O. Staudinger in the 1901 catalog, and later he described everything in great detail in an article by Lempke, who clearly pointed out that most of the names in this work are nomen nudum, only a small part is actually described or references were made to descriptions in other works. The use of ALL the names of Denis and Schiffermuller indiscriminately as valid and senior is another example of the creation of a special lepidopteric nomenclature by Western Europeans (another example is the non-use of the article of the Code on the grammatical agreement of generic and specific names). So I recommend using the name Epatolmis caesarea Goeze.

Regarding dippers and false mottles in one article, we can recommend:
OR:
name the article " dippers and false mottles...", then give both groups;
OR:
name the article " dipper...", and give only this group.

You can "play" on the fact that these two groups have different Russian names. After all, you are going to write about specific faunal finds, and not discuss the taxonomic relationship of these two groups.

How to write Latin is up to you, I can't recommend it, all points of view on whether it's one or different families with scoops and each other are purely subjective, and it's up to you to decide how to consider them. Each of these groups is monophyletic, and together with the scoops, they are also a monophyletic group.

I've just updated the lichen website, added information about the last two identified species from the southern Far East (Eilema affineolum and E. nankingicum), and posted a lot of new photos of butterfly genitalia. I will try to finish the site completely before the New Year. Please send me any questions or comments about the information on the site, or if you have any other questions about lichens.

This post was edited by vvdubatolov - 12/18/2010 12: 35

I've just updated the lichen website, added information about the last two identified species from the southern Far East (Eilema affineolum and E. nankingicum), and posted a lot of new photos of butterfly genitalia. I will try to finish the site completely before the New Year. Please send me any questions or comments about the information on the site, or if you have any other questions about lichens.

Please tell us the full name of the Ino's work that you link to on the site?

"The holotype of Eilema affineolum Brem., from Inoue, 1988, who synonymized Eilema tsinlingicum Dan. with this view."

Inoue, H. 1988. On the status of Eilema affineola (Bremer) (Arctiidae, Lithosiinae) // Yugato. No 113. P. 95-98.

I will definitely make a list of references on the site, but for now I am photographing the genitals of male butterflies.

And where in Ukraine do Eilema pseudocomplanum live, (in addition to the Crimea)? Are there any finds of Setina roscida other than the north? I will be very grateful for your answer!

In 2010, a book on the highest mottled lepidoptera of the Dnipropetrovsk region was published. authors Goloborodko K. K., Plyushch I. G., Pakhomov A. E. there are these species for the Dnipropetrovsk region.

In 2010, a book on the highest mottled lepidoptera of the Dnipropetrovsk region was published. authors Goloborodko K. K., Plyushch I. G., Pakhomov A. E. there are these species for the Dnipropetrovsk region.

And where can I get it?

And where can I get it?

The book is a small-run 300 copies, in Ukrainian, published by the Dnepropetrovsk University. I think so from the authors.

I just updated the lichen website. The new birth system is based on research by Holloway and Bendib. Part of the genera was placed by himself according to the signs of the structure of the genitals. Many new photos of male genitalia have been added. If you have any questions about this system, please contact us. I will be happy to discuss them.

Can you tell me what kind of view it is,
Ukraine, Khmelnitsky region, Polonny's neighborhood, 19.07.2004



ibid. 29.07.2002, is it Eilema lutarellum?

The upper image shows Eilema (Collita) griseolum, and the lower image shows Eilema (Setema) lutarellum. These two species are simply defined in Europe.

Just updated the online catalog of bears of the Oriental region, Australia and Oceania: http://fen.nsu.ru/~vvdubat/Arctiidae/ArctiinaeOriental.htm
Added two new views from India.

For Penzyak:

Sorry, I couldn't answer earlier - I was working on a website on lichens.
The ZIN collection includes two males of Lacydes spectabilis from the Penza region with labels: 28 Chemodanovka village, Penza region. VIII 1982 (Shlykov).
This species is confined to steppe and sedimentary habitats, flies in late summer and early autumn, and therefore comes across poorly. Photos of their caterpillars on this forum were given by Pavel Gorbunov. Thank you so much for the Chelis maculosa honesta map. All these points were unknown to me.

Good day to all!
It might be interesting. I noticed Chelis maculosa only in the south-west of the Tambov region of the Tambov region.1 specimen was found in the floodplain bedstraw-sage meadow on August 18.