Saturnia pyri

have you ever thought that in the wind, from which your jar is protected by a mixer, the latter can technically work in someone's head?

Thought, but if it falls, then on the side where the window is a small wasteland, and people do not go there) unless maniacs, then if it falls, it will be useful

This post was edited by Entomon - 02/18/2012 22: 15

I did it this way: the bucket with the pupae is on the split system, secured with a cord and an old water mixer (in case of strong wind), frosts do not fall below -7

You didn't do ventilation for the pupae, did you?...or during wintering,gas exchange in pupae is less intense than in warm seasons and pupae do not need ventilation?

You didn't do ventilation for the pupae, did you?...or during wintering,gas exchange in pupae is less intense than in warm seasons and pupae do not need ventilation?

There are 5 holes made in the container. Tell me, we had a forecast of -12 at night, they did not freeze there, provided that the neck of the cocoon is cut (it is slightly open)?

There are 5 holes made in the container.

... about ventilation - now I understand everything)

So the thing is, the cocoons are notched

This post was edited by Entomon - 02/20/2012 20: 27

..Personally, when I cut the cocoons and "sent" them to spend the winter, I additionally wrapped each cocoon in a napkin...just wrapped them up in a tube,so to speak...
You can do the same...or, if there are a lot of incised cocoons, then put cotton wool on the bottom of the "container" - lay the cocoons and cover them with another layer of cotton wool on top...simply put, wrap it in cotton wool)...I did that too)

... about ventilation - now I understand everything)
...it seems to me that since these saturnias have stable populations and are quite widespread in the middle zone, they must tolerate such frosts - there are worse winters in nature,and here in a plastic "barrier"

In nature, they are under the snow. It's not too cold under the snow. But neither a plastic container nor cotton wool will protect you from frost. Plastic will protect you from the wind, cotton wool from sudden changes in temperature.

Well, I threw them cotton wool, but how to moisten it in the cold? It absorbs all the moisture from the air. And in the cold, the water will freeze and what? and should they be wrapped in cotton wool at all, if the street is 0-- -3 during the day, and -5-- -12 at night?

Well, I threw them cotton wool, but how to moisten it in the cold? It absorbs all the moisture from the air. And in the cold, the water will freeze and what? and should they be wrapped in cotton wool at all, if the street is 0-- -3 during the day, and -5-- -12 at night?

And why should it be moistened in the cold?
I would not keep any covertly wintering pupae in nature at -12. Their already at -5 from the balcony clean.

I read here that they need to be frozen from -5 to -15 degrees for a more "friendly" exit, but what about the incised cocoons?

I read here that they need to be frozen from -5 to -15 degrees for a more "friendly" exit, but what about the incised cocoons?

I don't know about freezing. But the incised cocoon has nothing to do with the tightness of the exit. The cocoon is necessary to make it easier for the butterfly to get out of the pupal shell, in addition, a certain microclimate is created in the sealed cocoon. I had a case, after opening the cocoons, the scoop caterpillars that were growing in them died (dried up). I don't know about opening the peacock eyes ' cocoons. But I wouldn't do it without a reason.

Well, I threw them cotton wool, but how to moisten it in the cold? It absorbs all the moisture from the air. And in the cold, the water will freeze and what? and should they be wrapped in cotton wool at all, if the street is 0-- -3 during the day, and -5-- -12 at night?

..I think that in winter there is no need to moisten the" room " with pupae...especially since we are talking about pupae that will sleep in the cold)...well, I personally never moistened them - I was afraid that in the cold the moisture would simply freeze on the pupae and it would harm them...Maybe I was wrong,though...

And as for the friendly exit of butterflies, then, I think, even it is not necessary to freeze-just,for a while, to withstand all the cocoons at constant low temperatures, for example in the refrigerator)...
Well, all at one time the butterflies will not come out...if I'm not mistaken, males are born first, and then females)

..I think that in winter there is no need to moisten the" room " with pupae...especially since we are talking about pupae that will sleep in the cold)...well, I personally never moistened them - I was afraid that in the cold the moisture would simply freeze on the pupae and it would harm them...Maybe I was wrong,though...

And as for the friendly exit of butterflies, then, I think, even it is not necessary to freeze-just,for a while, to withstand all the cocoons at constant low temperatures, for example in the refrigerator)...
Well, all at one time the butterflies will not come out...if I'm not mistaken, males are born first, and then females)

I will keep males in the cold longer than females.

I'll keep the males out in the cold longer than the females.

...oh, by the way, you can do that...
And why do you need to get all the butterflies in the same time frame?...do you want the males to not have time to weaken while waiting for the females or what?

...oh, by the way, you can do that...
And why do you need to get all the butterflies in the same time frame?...do you want the males to not have time to weaken while waiting for the females or what?

Yes, I want to get the most offspring out of them. My parents told me that until I made all the money out of it, they wouldn't believe that breeding was a good thing... and I want to prove them otherwise.

This post was edited by Entomon - 02/21/2012 16: 50

Clearly)...well, at least if we do not talk about profit, then the knowledge gained in the breeding of butterflies can give a lot in the field of conservation of butterflies, whose numbers are falling...However, if the countries had the money and the desire (I'm talking about the SND countries - I haven't been to the West),then such skilled butterfly guardians as we could help in this matter...and so, we only breed insects either for our collections or for sale...it is a pity that there is no place to show your knowledge...although, I may be wrong - maybe someone has long been engaged in the "resurrection" of rare endangered butterflies)...that's even and not only rare and endangered...take even those widespread species - after all, the importance of butterflies in the ecosystem can not be taken away)

Yes, I want to get the most offspring out of them.

As far as I know, in order to get offspring, it is necessary that the males come out before the females. Otherwise, there may not be any offspring.
By the way, are you sure you can feed at least fifty - a hundred caterpillars-the offspring of just one female?

the knowledge gained in butterfly breeding can give a lot in the field of conservation of butterflies, whose numbers are falling........ such skilled butterfly keepers as we could help in this matter...

To save butterflies, it is necessary to preserve biotopes, and they will breed perfectly themselves.

 
To save butterflies, it is necessary to preserve biotopes, and they will breed perfectly themselves.

Yes, but this is known and understood,apparently,only by entomologists...others don't care...after all, really - limit the influence of nature - and do not look for ways to restore the number of insects...

Yes, but this is known and understood,apparently,only by entomologists...others don't care...after all, really - limit the influence of nature - and do not look for ways to restore the number of insects...

Yeah... this is especially understood by grandmothers who throw their caterpillars by handfuls into the fire! Pear saturniums!!!

This post was edited by Entomon - 02/21/2012 21: 29

I read the topic and got a few questions:
1. Why hide cocoons?
I understand that if you only have a couple of cocoons, open them before the butterflies
come out( sometimes the butterfly can't open the cocoon). I do not when I do not open the cocoons, the butterfly did not come out, it means not fate, because the exit from the cocoon is a kind of test, why breed those who did not pass this test? and then the questions, "small butterflies"
as okoem correctly pointed out, " By the way, are you sure you can feed at least fifty - a hundred caterpillars-the offspring of just one female?". For example, I'm not, I'm lazy, I grow on free bread (cherry), 10-15 caterpillars per tree.
2. Why such a fuss with storage? Outside in the snow, etc. Lie without problems in the refrigerator on the door. Before refrigerators, people could do the same thing without any problems, placing cocoons between wooden window frames.
3. Profit in entomology, rather a small compensation for hobby expenses.
Or not?

I read the topic and got a few questions:
1. Why hide cocoons?
I understand that if you only have a couple of cocoons, open them before the butterflies
come out( sometimes the butterfly can't open the cocoon). I do not when I do not open the cocoons, the butterfly did not come out, it means not fate, because the exit from the cocoon is a kind of test, why breed those who did not pass this test? and then the questions, "small butterflies"
as okoem correctly pointed out, " By the way, are you sure you can feed at least fifty - a hundred caterpillars-the offspring of just one female?". For example, I'm not, I'm lazy, I grow on free bread (cherry), 10-15 caterpillars per tree.
2. Why such a fuss with storage? Outside in the snow, etc. Lie without problems in the refrigerator on the door. Before refrigerators, people could do the same thing without any problems, placing cocoons between wooden window frames.
3. Profit in entomology, rather a small compensation for hobby expenses.
Or not?

1. I am not sure that from each clutch I will have even 10 caterpillars left, because I haven't bred them yet.
2. well, I think in a double-glazed cocoons will be problematic to cram, and in the refrigerator parents do not allow, they say: "so that this stuff in the refrigerator was not!!!"
3. I ordered 7 cocoons (you know who), even if I sell only 10 cocoons, I will make a profit.

1. I am not sure that from each clutch I will have even 10 caterpillars left, because I haven't bred them yet.

In this case, it doesn't really matter if you start with 20 eggs or 200. With improper care, everyone is still very likely to die.

when I had fifty adults eating, it was heard at night even in the farthest room (without closed doors), and even with deficits...there was a roar
in general, piri is quite easy to hold. I put it in the cellar for the winter, now I keep it in the refrigerator. they eat almost everything, but it's worth experimenting - I tried 10 different plants (different pears, apples, plums, etc.) on young husks, adults are less whimsical.
2 Entomon - if your parents are so determined, then let them pay for a diploma at the law school and arrange you for a "warm place" - this is their troubles. Do what you like! I've been working all my life (consciously) on all sorts of jobs for butterflies/bugs/books/trips and I've never had a penny from it (but this is everyone's business personally and I don't want to impose anything, if someone earns money on it-well done, I'm not old enough yet).
Entomologist is a state of mind!

  
I can imagine what they will say when you set up huge boxes in the middle of the apartment-cages with cherry plum branches and hundreds of caterpillars.

It'll be in my room, and they'll have a cage. 100*50*50 see?

This post was edited by Entomon - 02/24/2012 22: 14

 
2 Entomon - if your parents are so determined, then let them pay for a diploma at the law school and arrange you for a "warm place" - this is their troubles. Do what you like! I've been working all my life (consciously) on all sorts of jobs for butterflies/bugs/books/trips and I've never had a penny from it (but this is everyone's business personally and I don't want to impose anything, if someone earns money on it-well done, I'm not old enough yet).
Entomologist is a state of mind!  

You haven't heard how my watch works yet

I have Already Selected everything, ENTOMOLOGY

It'll be in my room, and they'll have a cage. 100*50*50 see?

I think a few dozen will be included. And where are the caterpillars from the rest of the females?

Entomon, never open your saturnia cocoons the way you do! When a butterfly exits through the top of an undisturbed cocoon, the veins on its wings stretch out and they spread out normally.In the case when the top of the cocoon is broken, there is a high chance that the butterfly will not be able to spread its wings. If you need to open the cocoon, do it from the side, so that before hatching, you can place the pupa in it and wrap the broken wall of the cocoon with something, such as a plaster. This applies not only to S. pyri

Entomon, never open your saturnia cocoons the way you do! When a butterfly exits through the top of an undisturbed cocoon, the veins on its wings stretch out and they spread out normally.In the case when the top of the cocoon is broken, there is a high chance that the butterfly will not be able to spread its wings. If you need to open the cocoon, do it from the side, so that before hatching, you can place the pupa in it and wrap the broken wall of the cocoon with something, such as a plaster. This applies not only to S. pyri

Well then you need to connect the incised parts

Last season, I raised pyri from eggs (about 400 pcs) - the offspring of 3 females. Now I would not advise without a SPECIAL desire and SPECIAL opportunities to grow this species in such quantities.

The first problem is a place for cages. Pyri caterpillars, like many other species that live in the crown of a tree, are very sensitive to excessive humidity. That is, the cages should be well ventilated, the food in them should not be tight, but gus. a little-otherwise the leaves will eat very quickly, you will have to change the feed often. More feed - excessive humidity-the result I had due to inexperience was the same as in the quote below:

The only thing that upset me was that during the second molt, 1/2 of all the caterpillars (there were about 50 of them in total) did not completely shed their old skins and simply died(...I only managed to "pull off" the old skins from 4-5 people , but I couldn't help the rest...
I wanted to ask the butterfly keepers, maybe someone had similar cases - what affected the death of caterpillars during molting?...why did half the caterpillars never shed their skins?...

As it turned out later, they got sick, and many of those who had faded (two and a half hundred) were covered with black spots in just a day or two and died. The picture was very scary Only constantly (2 times a day) otsazhivaya patients from healthy I was able to bring to the pupae 42 gus.

The second problem is time. My 4 hundreds in the first 2 weeks required only 3-4 medium (up to 30 cm) cherry plum branches per day. Until the second age, they lived in 3 (later 4) cages made of 5-liter plastic bottles. That is, every day spent time: cutting branches, examining them from unknown inhabitants(small spiders, beetles, etc.), installing them in cages. I had it for 1 hour. But this is before the disease and while gus. small! After the disease, the number of cages increased to 15( 10 gus each), then to 20(5 gus each)! In other words, the time spent increased to 2.5 hours per day. Somewhere at the stage of age 4, I moved everyone to a cage made of a cardboard box of 100 cm x 50 cm x 60 cm, tightened it with a grid with a maximum of cells, just so that they would not go for a walk on the balcony. Cherry plum branches had to be worn 2 times a day for a huge armful - the neighbor even asked if I had a goat
The third problem (possibly) is the availability of a feed base - as a result of growing pyri, I made a curly haircut for 5 spreading cherry plum trees

Last season, I raised pyri from eggs (about 400 pcs) - the offspring of 3 females. Now I would not advise without a SPECIAL desire and SPECIAL opportunities to grow this species in such quantities.

The first problem is a place for cages. Pyri caterpillars, like many other species that live in the crown of a tree, are very sensitive to excessive humidity. That is, the cages should be well ventilated, the food in them should not be tight, but gus. a little-otherwise the leaves will eat very quickly, you will have to change the feed often. More feed - excessive humidity-the result I had due to inexperience was the same as in the quote below:

As it turned out later, they got sick, and many of those who had faded (two and a half hundred) were covered with black spots in just a day or two and died. The picture was very scary Only constantly (2 times a day) otsazhivaya patients from healthy I was able to bring to the pupae 42 gus.

The second problem is time. My 4 hundreds in the first 2 weeks required only 3-4 medium (up to 30 cm) cherry plum branches per day. Until the second age, they lived in 3 (later 4) cages made of 5-liter plastic bottles. That is, every day spent time: cutting branches, examining them from unknown inhabitants(small spiders, beetles, etc.), installing them in cages. I had it for 1 hour. But this is before the disease and while gus. small! After the disease, the number of cages increased to 15( 10 gus each), then to 20(5 gus each)! In other words, the time spent increased to 2.5 hours per day. Somewhere at the stage of age 4, I moved everyone to a cage made of a cardboard box of 100 cm x 50 cm x 60 cm, tightened it with a grid with a maximum of cells, just so that they would not go for a walk on the balcony. Cherry plum branches had to be worn 2 times a day for a huge armful - the neighbor even asked if I had a goat
The third problem (possibly) is the availability of a feed base - as a result of growing pyri, I made a curly haircut for 5 spreading cherry plum trees

There will be no problems with the cages, I will build them at the dacha I will build one huge cage of slats covered with a grid.

Or maybe such soreness of caterpillars is the norm? After all, there are not very many butterflies in nature, so there is some mortality. I would have released a brood of caterpillars that had been grown up at home at the beginning - on a tree, even if I had the opportunity. Naturally, when growing, you need to use the same tree that you plan to produce. And after releasing on the tree-I would cover it with a net - this is necessary so that the birds do not eat the caterpillars. In theory, one tree should definitely be enough for the offspring of one female.

There will be no problems with the cages, I will build them at the dacha I will build one huge cage of slats covered with a grid.

A large cage is good, but you will still need to make sure that there is no crowding, and when molting, one does not disturb the other. Maybe you should get 2 cages?
With my own, I did this: those who were ready to shed, I did not touch and left in the cage with the eaten fodder, and the branches with the feeding ones were carefully cut off and transplanted to another cage with fresh fodder. In addition, it is difficult to remove a tightly clinging pyri from a branch without damaging it. In general, I gus. tried not to pick up, only with a twig or leaf. For this purpose, small wire cutters or side cutters are very convenient.
But growing it will still take a lot of time every day, because they will eat with a greater appetite . So that you don't have to cut armfuls of cherry plums for half a day, clean the cage and install fresh fodder.

This post was edited by kai-ya-02/25/2012 22: 07

I let it out on the tree in a bag, but all in one night bent down between 2 and 3 molts. still, we probably have cooler (Tambov). I keep it in a cage 80*80*30 more than fifty live together, do not get sick. they eat like horses, once a day an armful of pears. I tore it off / threw it off with my hands and together with the foliage they don't have much. from the first to the last ages.

I have my own trouble-how to bring out charax yacius-who helped

This post was edited by AGG - 02/26/2012 10: 44

A large cage is good, but you will still need to make sure that there is no crowding, and when molting, one does not disturb the other. Maybe you should get 2 cages?
With my own, I did this: those who were ready to shed, I did not touch and left in the cage with the eaten fodder, and the branches with the feeding ones were carefully cut off and transplanted to another cage with fresh fodder. In addition, it is difficult to remove a tightly clinging pyri from a branch without damaging it. In general, I gus. tried not to pick up, only with a twig or leaf. For this purpose, small wire cutters or side cutters are very convenient.
But growing it will still take a lot of time every day, because they will eat with a greater appetite . So that you don't have to cut armfuls of cherry plums for half a day, clean the cage and install fresh fodder.

Well, there probably won't be any crowding, sadok 1*1*2 meter, feed, I'll find it. We had a flood on the Podkumok river and demolished many dachas I think I will find food there. plants

How picky pyri is about food
I have a huge cherry plum tree ( dark red leaves ) not when I didn't see the caterpillars on it, maybe because of the color, the green caterpillars would look very contrasting on the red one. In general, cherry plums are not who does not eat, once I do not process it with anything.

I didn't notice that birds would be interested in caterpillars ,but ants mostly
Tetramorium will not calm down until they throw the caterpillar off the tree ( there is a photo session in the archives somewhere), so I use cherry, (tetra likes apricot as a sweeter one). Since spring, a couple of trees are not treated with anything on them and I feed the caterpillars, without any nets.
Well, a pear is a sacred taboo for caterpillars.

It is not advisable to breed pyri at home in the area where it lives.
It is easier not to treat several large forage trees with chemicals, but to set traps for pupation and collect ready-made cocoons.

BO. Please tell us more about the traps!

Traps are an understatement
On the trunk closer to the ground of the cordon tube 10 cm long inner diameter of 3 cm
is more effective plywood, chipboard, etc. on the ground near the tree with a gap from the soil of 2-3 cm,
or several sheets vertically. The slate is not suitable, the slate is occupied by mantises.

A butterfly hatched today. it dries up.
a small experiment failed, I wanted to bring my wife to the doctor's office, but I missed by 2 days
And another theory has not been confirmed, that you can determine the sex by the weight of the cocoon.
It was the lightest cocoon 6g, the female was bred

Pictures:

_IGP4465.jpg — (177.99к)

A butterfly hatched today. it dries up.
a small experiment failed, I wanted to bring my wife to the doctor's office, but I missed by 2 days
And another theory has not been confirmed, that you can determine the sex by the weight of the cocoon.
It was the lightest cocoon 6g, the female was bred

I told you , of all the cocoons you sold me, the lightest was that of a single female . And I have one question, when to put the cocoons in the heat?

It all depends on when you need butterflies
at a daytime temperature of 24-26C, butterflies are displayed on day 18 approximately