Entomological labels

Comrade Omar once asked me how I would transliterate Yelets. Now, in his place, I would ask how to transliterate if A. Y. Elez caught in Yelets.
For God's sake, don't be offended - it's just a thought that came to mind

I do not ask, because I foresee an answer of 5 pages of typewritten text, replete with complex sentences, Nabokov's digressions from the main topic, references to E. M. Antonova, and philosophical arguments about the causes of errors of GPS navigators.

I apologize to my colleagues for being late with the long-awaited introduction to the discussion of the issue . I honestly don't know how to transliterate here. Standards are floating. By the way, I have already mentioned this here; in fact, I repeat myself for those who have not looked at this topic in the past. Today, standards have more or less emerged, but God knows how long they will last. Therefore, I always considered it safer to repeat proper names in the original language (where possible). I personally do not speak German, and I always wrote in English to a friend in Germany. He also indicated my last name in English on the reply correspondence-Elez (by the way, my father's last name is written in the original). Our postmen, when writing on the envelope in Russian for the delivery people, always added "Yelets"in a flourish next to the name Elez - seeing that the cart was from Germany. Okay, that at least reached... There it is...

This post was edited by A. J. Elez - 02/27/2009 23: 47

I do not ask, because I foresee an answer of 5 pages of typewritten text, replete with complex sentences, Nabokov's digressions from the main topic, references to E. M. Antonova, and philosophical arguments about the causes of errors of GPS navigators.

Thank you for the excellent complex sentence with Nabokov's digressions from the main topic and a link to E. M. Antonova... Look at how many people have thanked you and how quickly. When have you ever had this happen before? I don't expect any thanks, but don't spit in the well either... I wish you further success!

This post was edited by A. J. Elez - 02/27/2009 21: 15

Thank you for the excellent complex sentence with Nabokov's digressions from the main topic and a link to E. M. Antonova... Look at how many people have thanked you and how quickly. When have you ever had this happen before? I don't expect any thanks, but don't spit in the well either... I wish you further success!

1. I "mastered" all your posts.
2. Good Russian language and characteristic style noted, however, the number of posts can not remember.
3. Yes, you were thanked. I wonder what for? I hasten to console you, this has happened repeatedly. Oh, yes thank you (seriously)
4. Never spat in wells.
5. Achievements should go on sale soon.

I suggest you just stop being touchy )

For those who collect insects inside the Garden Ring, this may not be important. But I have to put the name of the country on the label. To save space, I use international country codes. Thus, the first line also includes a region, or another division of a sufficiently high order. It is clear that I write labels in English. And I'm not going to be easier, as some comrades advise, and even more so switch to French or German.

This post was edited by Cerega - 02/28/2009 12: 05

well, French or German is already superfluous )
writing in English is quite normal

I write the country name and date in the first line.

I suggest you just stop being touchy )

Duc, we're just arguing a little bit.

For those who collect insects inside the Garden Ring, this may not be important. But I have to put the name of the country on the label. To save space, I use international country codes. Thus, the first line also includes a region, or another division of a sufficiently high order. It is clear that I write labels in English. And I'm not going to be easier, as some comrades advise, and even more so switch to French or German.

There is logic in this, there is a real simplification of the problem, but it is also introducing something new to the long-established standards for specifying places; isn't this creating a different problem? After all, we live in a time of very rapid change of some standards by others. Keep for a long time and do not lose clarity, oddly enough, it is those that are overgrown with moss. In addition, you tell us about such a decision here, but it is unlikely that you write on each label what these numbers are (what kind of space savings would it be then?), i.e. what exactly they express and in accordance with which international register, list, etc. If the international standard for encoding countries changes, of course, in the future it will be possible to find today's list of codes, but to do this, you will need to know from somewhere that these figures, which are incomprehensible to the future researcher, are the country code, and not something else. What should I do about it? As for English, they will be able to establish a natural language at any time, and today its use, at least for foreign material from a number of countries, is quite acceptable (almost none of us will write hieroglyphs, for example, and it will only be patriotic to rewrite them in our native language). But to determine in the future, without your help, which indicator and on which scale is expressed in the beginning of the usual Arabic numerals... Do you think you can count on this one hundred percent? Not only should the label not be ambiguous, but it should also be encrypted in the slightest (this is not a design standard that can still be improved, and not even a question of a set of data necessary for science, this is a fundamental principle without which there is no label for entomology).

This post was edited by A. J. Elez - 01.03.2009 01: 55

And who said that the code is expressed in numbers? It's alphabetic. RUS - Russia, UKR-Ukraine, CHN-China, ITA-Italy, etc. It is fascinating that all have three characters stably, and it is quite simple to decipher. And about moss, I completely agree, so I'm trying to find out the attitude to the innovation.

And who said that the code is expressed in numbers? It's alphabetic. RUS - Russia, UKR-Ukraine, CHN-China, ITA-Italy, etc. It is fascinating that all have three characters stably, and it is quite simple to decipher.

And it seemed to me that usually 2 letters are written? RU, UA, US, TZ, etc.

There is also such a code, but a three-letter one, it seems to me, is easier to decipher, and one weather sign will not do it.

And who said that the code is expressed in numbers? It's alphabetic. RUS - Russia, UKR-Ukraine, CHN-China, ITA-Italy, etc. It is fascinating that all have three characters stably, and it is quite simple to decipher. And about moss, I completely agree, so I'm trying to find out the attitude to the innovation.

This is a different matter. I thought it was something like an international list of three-digit numeric codes that are used on official cars abroad - diplomatic, trade missions, international organizations. And the letters are very soothing. But, of course, in particularly exotic cases, the Russian reader, say, will not be able to guess everything easily in many years. Those that you gave as an example, I can easily understand today (but they will not be very long in full), but if they slip me the code of the Kingdom of Tonga (I don't know what it is there), I will not immediately understand what the letters are and what they are for. Further, it is sometimes necessary to replace the old label (or, if it is not a purely temporary scrawl, but deserves eternal preservation, at least add a new one to unify labeling throughout the collection). But it is unlikely that there are codes for countries that did not live up to this encoding (at least with the old names), and even on the new label you need to indicate the toponymy at the time of collection. For example, the Upper Volta from the time of Major Ouedraogo... Or the Republic of the USSR. After all, we have a lot of material from there. And even more so-a lot of former (recently very) colonial territories. So in general, the system is quite acceptable, but a lot of tricky cases can also come up, there is something to think about.

This post was edited by A. J. Elez - 02.03.2009 02: 05

The most difficult problem is the labeling of China. It is very difficult to find such a big fuss in the names. Especially old fees. Those have to be reconstructed from the diaries of travelers, if any are published. For example, recently there was a reconstruction of the Groom's route through China, performed at a high level by Churkin and Grishuber, for which they are particularly grateful. This work helped me a lot.

Another interesting aspect of labeling is the change of names.
Alexandropol-Leninakan-Gyumri, for example
, is a very big problem, where of course old atlases and the Internet help us out
.There are many difficulties. Especially in Africa - there all the countries in 10 rows alternated, and the names of course.

Please help me create an entomological label if the butterfly Endromis versicolora was caught on May 3, 2009 in a mixed forest with a predominance of birch on the outskirts of Pugin's dacha, 2 km from Shuya, Ivanovo region.

Please help me create an entomological label if the butterfly Endromis versicolora was caught on May 3, 2009 in a mixed forest with a predominance of birch on the outskirts of Pugin's dacha, 2 km from Shuya, Ivanovo region.

Pictures:

1.jpg — (26.87 k)

help me choose the best option from three labels

IMHO, none of them
I would make a label like this:

UKRAINE,
Kharkov,
Kominternovskiy distr.,
on Prunus spinosa
02.05.2009
A. Shehovcov leg.

IMHO, none of them
I would make a label like this:

UKRAINE,
Kharkov,
Kominternovskiy distr.,
on Prunus spinosa
02.05.2009
A. Shehovcov leg.

I understand, thank you, so I will have

UKRAINE: Kharkov,
Kominternovskiy distr.,
on Prunus spinosa
A. Shehovcov leg.
02.05.2009

Did you write two dots (because that's how Americans write it)?
and the name of the trapper is written before the date (as far as I know)?

I don't put two dots, and I write my last name after the date, but this probably doesn't matter in principle, just a habit

help me choose the best option from three labels

What's the difference? The main thing is informative content, and the design, as you prefer.

Only need "02. V. 2009", so the correct

Just need "02. V. 2009", so it's more correct

And it will not happen, for example, as with an old clock, before rims on the dials, and now the usual numbers?

It will not happen, but some bourgeois from "abroad", looking at the label you gave, will not think that you caught this copy on the fifth of February instead of the second of May
P.S. What about the watch? Now many well-known companies produce models with a Roman dial, and it happens that there are no dials at all!

I will not write about the "stuffing" of labels, but I took the computer form of filling in the " Entomologist.people.<url>", the program is called "Labels Shortcut", it is packed with a bunch of languages, fill in whatever you want, the label is standard 8x18 mm. it is perfectly printed on the printer.

I will not write about the "stuffing" of labels, but I took the computer form of filling in the " Entomologist.people.<url>", the program is called "Labels Shortcut", it is packed with a bunch of languages, fill in whatever you want, the label is standard 8x18 mm. it is perfectly printed on the printer.

I also use this program.Yes, in principle it is convenient, except perhaps for one moment.She flatly refuses to understand the Russian language.When I switch to Russian, instead of normal Russian letters, some incomprehensible squiggles appear in the environment of this program.Has anyone experienced this problem?Or maybe I'm doing something wrong?

This post was edited by TEMPUS-06.01.2010 18: 51

I also use this program.Yes, in principle it is convenient, except perhaps for one moment.She flatly refuses to understand the Russian language.When I switch to Russian, instead of normal Russian letters, some incomprehensible squiggles appear in the environment of this program.Has anyone experienced this problem?Or maybe I'm doing something wrong?

For the Russian language, you need to select "Times Nev Roman C..." the second line with this abbreviation at the top, or in another way, from three lines similar to this - the middle one. I use it for the third year and I don't have any "squiggles" in the labels.

She flatly refuses to understand the Russian language.When I switch to Russian, instead of normal Russian letters, some incomprehensible squiggles appear in the environment of this program.Has anyone experienced this problem?Or maybe I'm doing something wrong?

For the Russian language, you need to select "Times Nev Roman C..." the second line with this abbreviation at the top, or in another way, from three lines similar to this - the middle one. I use it for the third year and I don't have any" squiggles " in the labels.

Either do as sergey nyu pointed out, or in the same place, in the "Font" menu, you need to select the Arial cyr or Arial CYR font (that is, Cyrillic). And everything will be fine!

This post was edited by Dmitrich - 20.01.2010 13: 08

I use Times New Roman (a table in Word).
For example, my labels (size 7x20mm.):

Pictures:

Labels.jpg — (153.26к)

I use Times New Roman (a table in Word).
For example, my labels (size 7x20mm.):

Zheleznodorozhny is a city of regional subordination and is not included in the Balashikha district of the Moscow region, therefore, geographical labels are incorrect

Zheleznodorozhny is a city of regional subordination and is not included in the Balashikha district of the Moscow region, therefore, geographical labels are incorrect

Yes , I know, Mikhail. This is a simple example (you can always remove something superfluous).
By the way: From 1952 until relatively recently, our city was part of the Balashikha district, and now it is like an island in the middle of the district (surrounded on all sides by it): http://www.balashiha.ru/genplan.php

This post was edited by vasiliy-feoktistov - 20.01.2010 14: 08

And one more thing, Mikhail. Let's say I crossed the Savvinsky pond (2 km from home) and catch in Purshevo: http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purshevo_(city...Okrug_balashikha) How to be

Many thanks to sergey nyu and Dmitrich for their answers!I really bothered with this program before, which I just did not do:both I wrote in Latin letters in Russian,and I tried to write in English (although I didn't have much English,and the labels,respectively,didn't work out very well).Now everything has improved.

And one more thing, Mikhail. Let's say I crossed the Savvinsky pond (2 km from home) and catch in Purshevo: http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purshevo_(city...Okrug_balashikha) What should I do

So write that "Balashikha district, D. Purshevo". And then, it may be that from the Railway side the species does not live. Moreover, the terrain changes dramatically there as well

So write that "Balashikha district, D. Purshevo". And then, it may be that from the Railway side the species does not live. Moreover, the terrain changes dramatically there

Thanks! The question is exhausted, I think, And then there is one bank of "Zhelezka", and the other is already Purshevo.

Yes , I know, Mikhail. This is a simple example (you can always remove something superfluous).
By the way: From 1952 until relatively recently, our city was part of the Balashikha district, and now it is like an island in the middle of the district (surrounded on all sides by it): http://www.balashiha.ru/genplan.php 

Administrative divisions are a dark and volatile business. See, for example, http://dic.academic.ru/dic.nsf/ruwiki/8466 Therefore, I have already suggested somewhere here that we limit ourselves to geographical coordinates using GPS...

Administrative divisions are a dark and volatile business. See, for example, http://dic.academic.ru/dic.nsf/ruwiki/8466 Therefore, I have already suggested somewhere here that we limit ourselves to geographical coordinates using GPS...

Yes, just put the coordinates in the label (free field to do separately) , I myself have already confused with these changes to be honest.

Four of you hold me...

Four of you hold me...

And why?

And why?

They won't keep you less. Reread the topic if you have time.